Interesting box ,Auction house stating it is by Carl Faberge
Most of us interested in these things may have other thoughts.
I felt it may be interesting to show what is happening around the auction scene.
Interested in opinions.
Regards Guido.
Blue enamel box Faberge?
Blue enamel box Faberge?
Hello Members
Interesting box ,Auction house stating it is by Carl Faberge
Most of us interested in these things may have other thoughts.
I felt it may be interesting to show what is happening around the auction scene.
Interested in opinions.
Regards Guido.
Interesting box ,Auction house stating it is by Carl Faberge
Most of us interested in these things may have other thoughts.
I felt it may be interesting to show what is happening around the auction scene.
Interested in opinions.
Regards Guido.
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Hi!
The pictures are not the best (better save the pictures and upload them than take a photo of the computer screen). Anyway the enamel box seems of fine quality and according to the style and period of Fabergé. As for the marks I believe the are authentic. Nothing major in them which would indicate otherwise. Thereby a genuine piece.
Regards,
Juke
The pictures are not the best (better save the pictures and upload them than take a photo of the computer screen). Anyway the enamel box seems of fine quality and according to the style and period of Fabergé. As for the marks I believe the are authentic. Nothing major in them which would indicate otherwise. Thereby a genuine piece.
Regards,
Juke
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Marks were applied (struck) before enameling, otherwise the enamel would crack if subject to hammering the marks. The holes for riveting wreath and cabochon stone had to be bored before enameling,too, and riveting carefully done could not affect the integrity of the enamel. My comment is based on several examples when faked Faberge marks were applied on silver far away from enamel to prevent the damage, meaning the box looks authentic. Unless, of course, there is an expert silversmith in guilloché and enameling, so skilled to produce this perfect piece.
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Hello AG & Duke
Thank you both for your replies and comments,
In my opinion I did not feel the Faberge mark looked right ,The P seems to me to look a bit square ,also not sure if symbol on top of mark is right also.
enlarging the image ,Quality of applied silver sections did not look great quality (if Faberge)
Estimate very low If Faberge. Not sure how much it sold for.
In other words I am surprised you both feel it is right. You both may be correct.
Regards Guido.
Thank you both for your replies and comments,
In my opinion I did not feel the Faberge mark looked right ,The P seems to me to look a bit square ,also not sure if symbol on top of mark is right also.
enlarging the image ,Quality of applied silver sections did not look great quality (if Faberge)
Estimate very low If Faberge. Not sure how much it sold for.
In other words I am surprised you both feel it is right. You both may be correct.
Regards Guido.
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
What can been seen from the picture the enamel box seems of fine quality. Also the neoclassical style was very fashionable and typical for Fabergé during this period. Of course to have the enamel box in the hand would verify correct the quality and weight.
Fabergé had a few different markings and the the К.фАБЕРЖЕ with a stylized double headed eagle is one of the common ones. The letters on genuine marks are quite square so nothing major notable there. The selection of the type of mark, the place of the mark and the size of the mark are also correct. The same goes for the control mark. There are very small variations with these marks which are common due to the fact that if the struck was a little bent.
In addition a very good notification by AG2012 how the object has technically been done and the questions related to it.
Thereby I believe and authentic object.
Fabergé had a few different markings and the the К.фАБЕРЖЕ with a stylized double headed eagle is one of the common ones. The letters on genuine marks are quite square so nothing major notable there. The selection of the type of mark, the place of the mark and the size of the mark are also correct. The same goes for the control mark. There are very small variations with these marks which are common due to the fact that if the struck was a little bent.
In addition a very good notification by AG2012 how the object has technically been done and the questions related to it.
Thereby I believe and authentic object.
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Hi all,
Please keep in mind that finding a genuine Faberge made object on today's various market places is not common. What you find are fakes, fakes and more fakes. I dare to say that 90-95% are faked objects. They are very well made, sometimes even better than genuine objects. Is the shown object a fake or not is a tricky case. The pictures are not good enough. Anyway, I have a question: The shown marks/punches are on the lid. Are there more marks on the body?
Please keep in mind that finding a genuine Faberge made object on today's various market places is not common. What you find are fakes, fakes and more fakes. I dare to say that 90-95% are faked objects. They are very well made, sometimes even better than genuine objects. Is the shown object a fake or not is a tricky case. The pictures are not good enough. Anyway, I have a question: The shown marks/punches are on the lid. Are there more marks on the body?
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Found the enamel box on the auction house site easily with the search function. The pictures on the auction site confirms my belief it is genuine.
As for the pictures can add that it has been marked on the lid and on the base as it should.
Description by the auction house:
A RARE RUSSIAN SILVER AND BLUE ENAMEL BOX
by Carl Fabergé, Moscow, c.1896-1908, square, the hinged cover centered by a pink foil-backed cabochon-cut topaz on a silver scroll and anthemion overlay on a deep blue engine-turned enamel ground, the four sides set with scroll and anthemion overlay on corresponding engine-turned enamel grounds, stamped marks on the underside of the cover and base, scratched inventory number 19870 on the underside of the base. 4 cm square, 90 grams gross
As for the pictures can add that it has been marked on the lid and on the base as it should.
Description by the auction house:
A RARE RUSSIAN SILVER AND BLUE ENAMEL BOX
by Carl Fabergé, Moscow, c.1896-1908, square, the hinged cover centered by a pink foil-backed cabochon-cut topaz on a silver scroll and anthemion overlay on a deep blue engine-turned enamel ground, the four sides set with scroll and anthemion overlay on corresponding engine-turned enamel grounds, stamped marks on the underside of the cover and base, scratched inventory number 19870 on the underside of the base. 4 cm square, 90 grams gross
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Hello Duke and others.
Thank you all for your thoughts on this box.
As Qrt .s says 90-95% are fakes ,Great for the buyer if this one genuine.I will go with your opinion.
I am not a Faberge expert (far from it)
(admin edit - see Posting Requirements )
Regards Guido.
Re Auction description ,As we know these are not always correct.
Example- A box I purchased ,was described as having ,Ruby and Jade stones,By the Auction House, Wrong .They are Garnets and turquoise. The price I paid probably reflected that they were not Rubies. A Ratzersdorfer box ,posted on this forum.
Thank you all for your thoughts on this box.
As Qrt .s says 90-95% are fakes ,Great for the buyer if this one genuine.I will go with your opinion.
I am not a Faberge expert (far from it)
(admin edit - see Posting Requirements )
Regards Guido.
Re Auction description ,As we know these are not always correct.
Example- A box I purchased ,was described as having ,Ruby and Jade stones,By the Auction House, Wrong .They are Garnets and turquoise. The price I paid probably reflected that they were not Rubies. A Ratzersdorfer box ,posted on this forum.
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Hi Guido
I have a very different opinion than yours.
In my opinion the rating is absurdly high for a 90 gram box of a quality that doesn't seem excellent to me, judging by the photo.
When I was in St. Petersburg I obviously visited the Fabergè museum: there were truly breathtaking things, but also cutlery little more than ordinary.
I could say the same about the Fabergè exhibition which was held a few years ago at the Venaria Reale near Turin.
The Fabergè mark, even if true, is not in itself a guarantee of unattainable quality.
Don't even talk about it if it's fake.
Best
Amena
I have a very different opinion than yours.
In my opinion the rating is absurdly high for a 90 gram box of a quality that doesn't seem excellent to me, judging by the photo.
When I was in St. Petersburg I obviously visited the Fabergè museum: there were truly breathtaking things, but also cutlery little more than ordinary.
I could say the same about the Fabergè exhibition which was held a few years ago at the Venaria Reale near Turin.
The Fabergè mark, even if true, is not in itself a guarantee of unattainable quality.
Don't even talk about it if it's fake.
Best
Amena
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Hi everyone,
Just a short notice. Fabergé would hardly put a relatively cheap stone on an object like this looking like an overdecorated Christmas tree.
Just a short notice. Fabergé would hardly put a relatively cheap stone on an object like this looking like an overdecorated Christmas tree.
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Just to make some additions to the earlier.
Fabergé did of course make the well known royal and stately gifts with extraordinary quality. However these were just a few orders during the year and not their main business. Check for instance their catalogue on this site what they offered, basically simplistic coffee and tea sets, cigarette cases, snuffboxes etc. for the new middle class bourgeois people with extra money and of some what finer quality compared to for instance other court suppliers.
I fully agree this box is not the same quality as for the royal and stately gifts. On the other hand compared with other firms in the era I would say this is finer quality. I don't think there is any mentionable number of finer quality guilloché enamel objects from other manufactures than this box?
Fabergé was not only know for diamond encrusted gold/gilded objects but especially also for only using less expensive materials like nephrite, rock crystal, moon stones etc. on objects. In addition all the silversmiths at Fabergé were not as qualified as Wigström. Fabergés main focus was the multi-colour guilloché enamel that was their triumph with strong blue, green, rose, pink etc. colours mixed on same object. Fully understand not everybodies taste today.
As for exhibitions and also for many Fabergé books it is very true that the highlights are on the fantastic royal and stately gifts which distracts from the overall production. Noted above also well that in Fabergé exhibitions you should remember the more ordinary objects too down to the small simplistic jetons which are only somewhat above other manufacturers quality.
Everybody likes of course to be right. Anyway without anymore knowledge I think it is better agree to disagree.
Fabergé did of course make the well known royal and stately gifts with extraordinary quality. However these were just a few orders during the year and not their main business. Check for instance their catalogue on this site what they offered, basically simplistic coffee and tea sets, cigarette cases, snuffboxes etc. for the new middle class bourgeois people with extra money and of some what finer quality compared to for instance other court suppliers.
I fully agree this box is not the same quality as for the royal and stately gifts. On the other hand compared with other firms in the era I would say this is finer quality. I don't think there is any mentionable number of finer quality guilloché enamel objects from other manufactures than this box?
Fabergé was not only know for diamond encrusted gold/gilded objects but especially also for only using less expensive materials like nephrite, rock crystal, moon stones etc. on objects. In addition all the silversmiths at Fabergé were not as qualified as Wigström. Fabergés main focus was the multi-colour guilloché enamel that was their triumph with strong blue, green, rose, pink etc. colours mixed on same object. Fully understand not everybodies taste today.
As for exhibitions and also for many Fabergé books it is very true that the highlights are on the fantastic royal and stately gifts which distracts from the overall production. Noted above also well that in Fabergé exhibitions you should remember the more ordinary objects too down to the small simplistic jetons which are only somewhat above other manufacturers quality.
Everybody likes of course to be right. Anyway without anymore knowledge I think it is better agree to disagree.
Re: Blue enamel box Faberge?
Hello members
Many thanks for every ones reply .
I also noticed The same box for sale at another company (may be red flag,two identical boxes) although Faberge may have may more than one?
I was surprised When I had another look at the box (originally thought large box 100x100cms) actual size 4x4cms very tiny box.Why would they make such a small box?
Interesting in discussing the quality that firms made ,were all there object the same quality ?as we all tend to judge by.Or did they also make lower quality items?
And, is this the same for all makers? sometimes ,we say about the makers mark ,that the mark is correct but the quality is not there.
Are we correct when we say this? I believe makers did not always make every object to the super high standards,of their best works.
That is why I feel it is better to buy the article than the mark ,lots of great things in museums do not have marks.
(admin edit - see Posting Requirements )
Regards Guido.
Many thanks for every ones reply .
I also noticed The same box for sale at another company (may be red flag,two identical boxes) although Faberge may have may more than one?
I was surprised When I had another look at the box (originally thought large box 100x100cms) actual size 4x4cms very tiny box.Why would they make such a small box?
Interesting in discussing the quality that firms made ,were all there object the same quality ?as we all tend to judge by.Or did they also make lower quality items?
And, is this the same for all makers? sometimes ,we say about the makers mark ,that the mark is correct but the quality is not there.
Are we correct when we say this? I believe makers did not always make every object to the super high standards,of their best works.
That is why I feel it is better to buy the article than the mark ,lots of great things in museums do not have marks.
(admin edit - see Posting Requirements )
Regards Guido.