Maker of SF Coin Spoons

[SilverSurfer]

I acquired a set of five nearly matching serving spoons, two of which are marked "V&CO.", and are the Gothic Pattern by Vanderslice and Company of San Francisco. The three other spoons are very similar to the first two, but the dies are clearly different on close inspection. These other spoons have no maker's mark, but two are marked with what I assume is the retailer's stamp, "M.M.BALDWIN & CO.", and the third is marked "?????OOD S.F.CAL. COIN". The major difference in the two sets of spoons is the die-struck pattern at the drop, pictured below:



The text, "Silver In The Golden State", identifies patterns similar to Vanderslice Gothic as Gothic by Eaves and Nye and also by Koehler and Ritter, as well as Eureka by Schulz and Fischer. Can anyone identify the maker of the mystery spoons? TIA!

SS
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[SilverSurfer]

Well, the mystery continues. But, as far as who made what in terms of early San Francisco silver, here's a perhaps interesting piece. This is a sugar shell, 17.7 cm in length (6 15/16 in.) and 36 gm in weight (1.3 oz. avoir.). It is an olive pattern variant, here's the pic:



Now, here are the maker's and retailer's marks:



Now, was this piece made by Vanderslice and retailed by Shreve, or made by Shreve and retailed by Vanderslice? This is just for fun, I believe I know the answer, but it is interesting to me, at least, that there was apparently some decent cooperation between these two early SF silver makers.
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[SilverSurfer]

No takers? Okay, despite the Shreve mark being well centered and the Vanderslice mark more cavalierly struck, according to the "Silver In The Golden State" text, the spoon was most likely made by Vanderslice, in its Waterlilly pattern (not dated in the text, but, according to placement in the line up, apparently 1860 or a mite earlier). A bit of review to remediate my faulty recollection shows no real question as to maker/retailer, given that though George Shreve arrived in San Francisco in the 1850s, he was mainly a retailer, and didn't start manufacturing until the 1880s or so. And so I imagine his retailer's mark probably adorns a fair number of early San Francisco maker's works.
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[SilverSurfer]

Regarding my original inquiry, the plot thickens. As noted before, the "Gothic" pattern as used by a number of early San Francisco makers seems to have at least two major variants, most well distinguished from each another at the drop, one by Vanderslice (perhaps by others as well) having a "pointed" middle and "rounded" sides, and another having a "rounded" middle and "pointed" spear leaf sides. (See above photos, I trust this heavy duty and arcane silver technological jargon is not confusing anyone ;o). So far, the unidentified pattern with the spear leaf sides at the drop has shown up with retailer's marks of M.M.BALDWIN & CO., the previously stated "...OOD" mark which I now believe is BARTLETT & SHERWOOD, and, just received, M.M.FREDERICK VIRG. NEV. (i.e., Virginia City, Nevada), not early San Francisco per se, but part of the important San Francisco-Comstock Lode silver connection. So, might anyone have this particular pattern with the mystery maker's mark stamped??? TIA!

SS
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[SilverSurfer]

Oops, the spoon is actually marked M. M. Fredrick, not the more common form of Frederick as I misread at first glance. Sorry for the error. I see that the M. M. Fredrick jewelry store in Virginia City burned down in the great fire of 1875, don't know whether he continued business or not thereafter.

SS
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[SilverSurfer]

Well, this is driving me nuts (not a terribly long trip, alas). Monitoring that current major world showcase of coin silver flatware sales, Fleabay, I've now seen the Gothic/Eureka pattern with the Vanderslice (V&Co.) type of treatment at the drop with the competing makers' marks of F. R. REICHEL, SCHULZ & FISCHER (successors to Reichel), and KOEHLER & RITTER. That leaves Eaves and Nye as the remaining early and large San Francisco makers that I haven't as yet seen marked on one of the two variants, though they are not even connected with the major pattern in question in "Silver In The Golden State". In light of that, the mystery pattern may perhaps be an earlier or later variant of the style by Vanderslice, Reichel, S&F, or K&R. Might anyone be able to identify the mystery maker? It's indeed driving me to drink (hey, any excuse in a storm ;o).

SS
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[SilverSurfer]

So no one yet to save me from myself? A minor update, I recently obtained three teaspoons, two of the Vanderslice pattern, but incuse marked "KOEHLER & RITTER", and the third the pattern of the unidentified maker, marked only "COIN.", alas. The search continues. Another mystery arrived in the form of a 22.2cm, 43g fiddle pattern tablespoon, marked only "J. W. TUCKER & CO", an early San Francisco retailing jeweler. Scan (bottom side):



The shape is similar to Lawler Plain No.2, the silver "JACKS & WOODRUFF" spoon at Argentum Antiques, and maybe a hundred others as made then east of the Rockies. Does anyone do an affordable (i.e., cheap) X-ray fluorescence or neutron activation analysis nowadays?
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[byron mac donald]

Hello Tia-

It seems that you have answered all of your own questiions here on this subject. I know a lot less about silver than you, but enjoy the quest. What is the quest we are after again? I am lost.

Regards- Byron
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[SilverSurfer]

Hi, Byron! Sorry if I've confused the issue by bringing in a couple of extraneous items also related to early San Francisco silver, just to improve on the silence, I guess, in case there are readers who are also interested in this region and time. The original quest continues, that is, who is the San Francisco area maker of the spoons in the pattern as shown in the first post, but with the differing pattern at the drop as shown in the lower photo, below the one marked "V&CO"?



So far I've seen the following makers' marks on the pattern with the "V&CO" style drop:

Vanderslice ("V&CO")
"F.R.REICHEL"
"SCHULZ&FISCHER"
"KOEHLER&RITTER"

This leaves Eaves&Nye and Wm. Lawler of the major early SF makers that I haven't seen on this spoon pattern, but perhaps they never made this pattern. And maybe one of the previously mentioned makers made this pattern with the drop change. So I'm still on the lookout for this variant with a maker's mark on it. So far all I have seen on this variant are the following retailers' marks:

M.M.BALDWIN
BARRETT&SHERWOOD
M.M.FREDRICK

Okay, but no cigar, I'd like to make a positive ID of the maker. So, TIA (that's "thanks in advance") for anyone who can supply the answer!

SS
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[silverly]

There may not be anything significant here or even not already seen often enough, but just in case, a link seemed apropos. viewtopic.php?t=7837
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