Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
Everyone seems to list their Curtis & Co. as being genuine Coin rather than the German Silver or Silverplate that the firm also produced. What this weeks’ concensus on what we see here? TIA
Re: Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
Pieces I see with that sort of pronounced drop are far more likely to be plate versus coin. How stiff is the handle? Coin has flex, German silver far less. Silver will also ring clearly.
Re: Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
::::: Just browsing through the pictures from the people who think they have coin silver and all the objects have that slightly-unnatural shininess that is probably German Silver (or Nickel Silver) ::::::::: Does anyone have a known coin silver example from this company? :::::::::
::::: There's another company that is usually nickel silver but sometimes is coin silver, is it N. MATSON that I am thinking of? I posted about it awhile back, it is a company that produced both coin silver and base metal spoons, I will try to figure it out :::::::::::::
::::: I might have one single small coin silver ladle with that kind of pronounced drop, will double-check that. ::::::
::::: I did find an 800 silver soup ladle with that kind of drop, but I guess these European ladles are different from the style of ladle to which you refer:
::::: Flexing the handle is what I would have done too & the bowl does have a little bit of that "unnatural shininess" that I think is German silver, but the tarnish pattern does kind of make me think that it could be coin silver, so I'm interested to know what you figure out ::::::
::::: There's another company that is usually nickel silver but sometimes is coin silver, is it N. MATSON that I am thinking of? I posted about it awhile back, it is a company that produced both coin silver and base metal spoons, I will try to figure it out :::::::::::::
::::: I might have one single small coin silver ladle with that kind of pronounced drop, will double-check that. ::::::
::::: I did find an 800 silver soup ladle with that kind of drop, but I guess these European ladles are different from the style of ladle to which you refer:
::::: Flexing the handle is what I would have done too & the bowl does have a little bit of that "unnatural shininess" that I think is German silver, but the tarnish pattern does kind of make me think that it could be coin silver, so I'm interested to know what you figure out ::::::
Re: Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
I tried comparing it to known grades of other ladles. The immediate problem is that Curtis was using a much thicker gauge which affects the results. There is definite flex but a bit more resistant than Continental 800 and 750 grades of alloy (in a thinner gauge of course). The tapping at various parts does not have a clear “ting”, but more like banging on the lead plumbing pipes, yet not a completely dead dull “thud”. Personally, I’d be leaning toward 95% chance of galvanic plated German Silver and 5% likelyhood of actual coin. That thick drop does raise questions about what that factory complex was up to. Did they blow all the revenue on trying to be better, thus ending up broke at the end of the day?
Re: Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
::::::: "On 18 September 1854, the company was reorganized under the name of Curtisville Manufacturing Co. By 1857 the region occupied by the manufactory was called Curtisville, with its own post-master. During the Civil War, Curtis sold to the Connecticut Arms and Manufacturing Company. ::::::::
:::::: Sounds like they were successful, the whole region was named after Curtis and they had their own post-master. :::::: Maybe they had been planning on selling it to the Connecticut Arms and Manufacturing Company for awhile? ::::::
::::::: This record of a small ladle seems to indicate that it is coin silver:
Silver ladle with a tipped fiddle-end handle, chamfered shoulders, and deep oval bowl, which is marked "F. CURTIS" in a rectangle for Frederick Curtis. Frederick Curtis started sometime in 1834 in Hartford at 1 Asylum Street, and manufactured silverware and spectacles. About 1846, Curtis bought the buildings and land for his company in an area of Glastonbury. In 1848, Curtis officially went into partnership with his brother, Joseph S. Curtis, calling the company, F. Curtis & Co.
::::::::: So if you find a piece marked "F. CURTIS" in a rectangle then it would be made during the period 1834-1846 before Curtis bought the buildings and land and went into partnership with his brother and started using the "F. CURTIS & CO." hallmark? ::::::: If he was working in a small shop manufacturing silverware and spectacles, that does sound like something more geared towards working with coin silver, that's just the impression that I get. ::::::::
:::::: Sounds like they were successful, the whole region was named after Curtis and they had their own post-master. :::::: Maybe they had been planning on selling it to the Connecticut Arms and Manufacturing Company for awhile? ::::::
::::::: This record of a small ladle seems to indicate that it is coin silver:
Silver ladle with a tipped fiddle-end handle, chamfered shoulders, and deep oval bowl, which is marked "F. CURTIS" in a rectangle for Frederick Curtis. Frederick Curtis started sometime in 1834 in Hartford at 1 Asylum Street, and manufactured silverware and spectacles. About 1846, Curtis bought the buildings and land for his company in an area of Glastonbury. In 1848, Curtis officially went into partnership with his brother, Joseph S. Curtis, calling the company, F. Curtis & Co.
::::::::: So if you find a piece marked "F. CURTIS" in a rectangle then it would be made during the period 1834-1846 before Curtis bought the buildings and land and went into partnership with his brother and started using the "F. CURTIS & CO." hallmark? ::::::: If he was working in a small shop manufacturing silverware and spectacles, that does sound like something more geared towards working with coin silver, that's just the impression that I get. ::::::::
Re: Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
Curtis is listed in Hartford city directories as "German silver manufacturer, office 1 Asylum." He is not mentioned as a silversmith, unlike the twenty plus others who were working there at the time.
The Curtisville partnership was in a serious financial state and declared insolvent in 1860. It was reorganized by Thomas Vail, who continued making britannia and silverplated wares. At the outbreak of the Cival War, he reorganized again and it became Connecticut Arms and Manufacturing Company. There was an attempt to return to civilian production after the war, but the company went bankrupt in 1869.
I have found nothing to indicate the Hartford Frederick Curtis ever worked in coin. There was another Frederick Curtis who was an active silversmith in Burlington Vermont until his death in 1815.
The Curtisville partnership was in a serious financial state and declared insolvent in 1860. It was reorganized by Thomas Vail, who continued making britannia and silverplated wares. At the outbreak of the Cival War, he reorganized again and it became Connecticut Arms and Manufacturing Company. There was an attempt to return to civilian production after the war, but the company went bankrupt in 1869.
I have found nothing to indicate the Hartford Frederick Curtis ever worked in coin. There was another Frederick Curtis who was an active silversmith in Burlington Vermont until his death in 1815.
Re: Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
Here’s an article found in google books that applies to this post. https://books.google.com/books?id=qvcYA ... AF6BAgGEAM
Re: Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
Perhaps to add to the story, there is a Frederick Curtis, silversmith, listed in the 1860 Hartford City census. He is an unmarried, born in 1799, and living in the city poor house.
Re: Ladle: Frederick Curtis & Co.
:::::::: I see some pieces marked F. CURTIS in rectangle that are almost certainly German Silver, so maybe he was working in German Silver even in the time when he was selling silverware and spectacles in his small shop before he made the big purchase of land :::::::::::::::::: Wonder who was that F. Curtis who died in 1815, and have any of his pieces been found. :::::::::