Italian silver. Help!

[Spell]

Hi Members

This is a sports prize. Made in Italy. There are three marks on it:
1. .800
2. marks of the master or workshop
3. number / fascia / province

At the bottom of the wooden stand there is a sticker indicating the workshop - "Virano gioielli Torino"

I know Virano, but the small mark - 38 GE (may be)). Genova? But Verano is Torino.

Big round mark - it wath: dragon, cauldron or ???

I'm at a loss. I can't find the master's name.
I hope for help)).

[amena]

HI
Virano is evidently the dealer and therefore it is not a problem if the silversmith's mark is not from Turin.
Instead, it is a problem that the round mark looks exactly like that of Messulam, which however should have 32 MI in the lozenge.
It doesn't look like that from the photo

[Spell]

amena, thank you very much!
Hmm... three different roads... Sold, redone, eventually ended up in Turin, where it was awarded to the winning team.
One might assume that the object originally had a different meaning, but it also looks like a Prize, not like a vase.
Mysterious and interesting )).

[amena]

Could you thoroughly clean the inside of the lozenge and post a focused photo of the result?

[Spell]

ok.
A little later, I will get access to the prize againin a few days

[Spell]

amena,
I was looking through my archive.
There is another sports prize in this collection. The wooden part, I think, is lost.
Marks:
1. .800
2. Messulam
3. ????




Tomorrow I will to clean the lozenge and post a photo.
Two prizes at once. One thing can be a mistake, two things - a system.

[amena]

The two cups are certainly from Messulam. In the item listing on the Messulam Trademark Registry page,"coppe da premio" i.e. "prize cups" are explicitly specified, and the mark with the two dwarfs working on the cup is unmistakable.

[dognose]

Is it possible that the cups were made by an outworker (GE 38?) of/for Messulam?

Trev.

[amena]

Possible.
But I think it is essential to first of all have a clear photo of the well-cleaned diamond mark.
It doesn't seem to me that I read an E as the last letter, at most an F, which doesn't exist.

[Spell]

hi!
First prize
amena - you are absolutely right.
I cleaned the mark and read MI.
This is indisputably a Messulam.




Second prize
I cleaned it, but the mark is fuzzy.
I'd like to see MI here, but... should be careful. There is no clarity.