Judaica,Poland Besamim

[madej]

Hallo
What do you think about this besamim? I think the flag and bells are secondary. It seems to me that it looks so good,but this silversmith Abram Reiner made rather a filigree besamim and worked until 1880, that is, as the sign.
Is the original or fake?

[madej]

Click on the image for better quality

[AG2012]

Hi,
You know I`m always benevolent.This is constructed from a candlestick, judaica being lucrative. So, forget it.
Regards

[madej]

Thanks. Honestly, the first time I saw it, I thought it was made from a candlestick. Secondly, this silversmith made the first of all the filigree besamim.
Thanks!
Regards

[madej]

Hmm.however, the basis is not too small for a candlestick?

[AG2012]

Hello,
Right, the base is small for a candlestick but nevertheless,it does not look right.Bells are not silver as far as I can see in the images.
What`s imperial eagle mark ? Reiner was not appointed to the Imperial Court.

[Dane111]

After checking many examples of similar shaped works by Charlap (http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic ... 93#p148093), I'm sure this one is original. Not everything is in hallmarks. Importants is style, methods of manufacturing, techniques, decoration, traces of age, patina etc. All looks correct. It's not artificial aged. The engravement style, chasing, construction - all correct. I have no idea why Tsar's eagle is stamped on the door. It would be great to have better pictures of hallmarks. You can ask on the Russian forum (Russian language). If ou need help with writing in Cyrillic - send me PM, I will help you. Regards, Dane

[Dane111]

http://cja.huji.ac.il/browser.php?mode= ... maker_name
Here one of the besamins has also brass/bronze bells. Maybe originally silvered, maybe they simple bought ready sub-product and silver was not available immediately and they had to finish it fast (maker's 100 ears ago were people too, not perfect in everything, many times with lack of cash), maybe brass to make it cheaper, maybe to offer for people having less cash, maybe to make two colours version. Maybe changed later. Many possibilities, but brass bells are not reason to tell it's fake. IMHO.
Best regards,
Peter

[Goldstein]

Hi Dane111 -

here the birth place of this "besamim" - some sort of recicling....

All looks correct. It's not artificial aged. The engravement style, chasing, construction - all correct. I have no idea why Tsar's eagle is stamped on the door.

It is not the Tsar´s eagle - it is the famous "cauliflower"- trademark of the fakers.

Regards
Goldstein