Bowl on foot. Kassel.

[zilverik]

Hello,

This bowl (330 grams) has the marks of Kassel and makersmark IB = Isaac Beauclair. Master in 1753, died in 1793 according to Rosenberg. Rosenberg also says that a bowl like this (Spuelkumpchen) from his hands is known. It is difficult to guess what the date is. Anyone knows? There are no other marks than IB and the townmark (apart from the later Dutch mark ZII). There is no mark "13" as aspected by me. Is that common with German silver? Anyone knows?

Regards,

Zilverik

[Theoderich]

it is interesting -
This hallmark has been used approximately 1670-1748 (*Dr.Dr.Neuhaus, Kasseler Silber, p.336 BZ:3)

but it seems to have been used for some years more

[zilverik]

Thank you Theoderich.

So it is probably an early piece of Beauclair? Is there anything to say about the form at that time? The form as I see it is very plain. I know that sort of plain work from Vienna early 19e century. So at first I thought it could be Vienna, but than I looked at the town mark and it appears to be Kassel. The book of Neuhaus I just ordered. I am especially interested in the silverfashion in Kassel around that period. It should give a clue to the date the bowl was made.

Regards,

Zilverik

[Theoderich]

In the book of Dr.Dr. Neuhaus you will find a similar work of Johann Friedrich Junck (ca. 1730-40)
page 110, no 65

[zilverik]

Hi Theoderich,

Thanks very much. I found a lot in the book of Dr. Neuhaus. Indeed almost the same bowl. Interesting that master IB is called slightly different here than in Rosenberg: Isaak Baucair (nr.99). He was a student mid of april 1737 - 6.1.1742 (with his father,) starts to working for him at 9.3.1753. The Kassel town mark on the bowl looks most at BZ 3 (page 336). This mark was used from 1670 till 1748 (page 334). And this particular mark looks the most at the mark nr. 28 (page 346). That is the mark for 1747/1748. It was not used after that according to Ernst-Ludwig Richter. Starting 24.6.1748 the date letter "A" was added till 24.1.1751. The date letter "B" was added. So, how is it possible that Isaak Beaucair's bowl was stamped with the mark 1747/1748? He wasn't a master yet.

Regards,

Zilverik

[zilverik]

Hi,

Now, having put on questions about non-matching years, It is plausible that this bowl is a forgery. However, for me the bowl looks and feels good. So I had a better look at the marks.The mastermark IB looks O.K. to me. Please have a look at the better photos (the last one is the underside of the rim). It could be that the part of the Kassel-townmark where the date letters could be is just badly struck. So, it could be possible that the date letter (B to M) was part of the mark, but is missing on the bowl. Could that explain the non-matching years?

Regards,

Zilverik

[Theoderich]

the hallmark is this from ca.1670 .. ca.1747 ....

George Schmidt *1673 +1735



compare the hallmarks

[zilverik]

Hi Theoderich,

Isaak Beaucair started as a student after George Schmidt passed away. So, the combination of the town mark from his time with the mastermark of Beaucair is very strange. So the marks point to forgery. I think I do best to have the silver content examined whether this bowl is from those days.

Regards,

Zilverik

[Theoderich]

I have no doubt that this dish is genuine. The hallmark is authentic and from this time. It has been used for a long time and probably even after 1747. Is also the possibility for the son of a goldsmith , that he has already made ​​pieces before he became a master . Maybe he even used his own stamp on it ?
I will aks Dr. Neuhaus about it.

[Theoderich]

This hallmark was used ca.1670 until ca.1747.
Isaak Beaucair starts to work in 9.3.1753.
The answere could be - it is a item from Johann Friedrich Junck (ca. 1730-40) like Neuhaus, Kasseler Silber, page 110, no 65.

As Beaucair began with his work , he bought old objects other goldsmiths in , distant their master's mark and put in place its own master brand under.

The reason: to save taxes.

[zilverik]

That is an explanation, but I don't fully understand. Probably Junck had already paid the taxes (otherwise there was no town mark). For Beaucair to put his mark in place of Juncks mark, provides Beaucair a tax benefit? What a tax rule could that be?

Regards,

zilverik

[Theoderich]

In this time was war - and so someone sell his silver to a goldsmith - and the goldsmith resell this object, after he replaced the old makersmark.