Help me identify these silver hallmarks of pair candlesticks

[elcid51]

Help me identify these silver hallmarks of pair candlesticks- Thanks

[Francais]

Welcome to the forum.
The first set of marks look too early for the candlesticks, so are probably pseudo marks. The second set of marks have too much glare to make them out. If you could use indirect lighting or put an opaque substance, like a plastic milk carton or a sheet in between the light source and the subject, it would help. If you can't take better photos, you should look at marks from Hanau Germany on this site, as the sticks look relatively modern and German in style.
Maurice

[elcid51]

Hello Maurice, I also have doubts about the authenticity of the chandeliers, even if they were purchased in a French auction house last November, I attach more photos of the previous best hope for have your opinion.
Photos 1 and 2 of candlestick 1, photos 3 and 4 of candlestick 2, photo 5 of French auction house. Thanks, Guido

[Francais]

Well, first I should say I am not an expert on Belgium silver. But I would say the style is c. 1770. I think the three marks are the original marks.
The first mark looks like initials, but I think they are actually a date "67", they did, at this period use dates. The second mark which I thought was a guarantee mark is actually a maker's mark. It is shown in Rosenberg, and identified as Jean van Campenhoudt, worked from 1762-1791 in Mechelen/ Malines. I think the same mark may have been used by Jean J. Campenhoudt. So that fits. k
I just figured out that each candlestick has a different set of marks. Which explains everything.
So the second set of mark are Bruxelles. The fist is a lion the second a face with a cross above, which are right for the 1760's period. The third mark is a date mark, I can't make out the second number but it might be 61. The last is the maker's mark, and I can't make it out at all.
So one candlestick was made, then the other is a copy to make a pair. If the date is 61 then it was made in Bruxelles first then Mechelen for the copy, or the other way around. There should be owner's initials or arms engraved somewhere.
Maurice

[oel]

Hi Maurice you are right,



From left to right;
The Brabant Lion already in use in 1400. Archangel Saint Michael,the city's patron from the city's coat of arms of Brussels, is added in 1480 at the latest in the form of a head topped with a cross. That of the saint on foot defeating the dragon is used from around 1750 to 1775.
The year letter, I can confirm is for the year 1767, exactly right as shown in the book: Zilver met Brusselse Keuren by Jacques Vanwittenbergh.
The last mark, the maker’s mark could be a hat (deformed) for the Brussels silversmith; Petrus Augustinus Ivens. The book shows a pair of candle sticks made by Petrus Augustinus Ivens, hight 24,6 cm, diameter base 14,1 cm, the octagonal base with alternating straight and wavy sides with volutes, not the same as the single candle shown here on the forum but comparable.

Oel.