Identity of maker please?

[charlesk]

http://s7.postimage.org/3uydtg7iz/IMG_4350.jpg

http://s7.postimage.org/wymlpovmj/IMG_4343.jpg

(admin photo edit - images too large - link only - see Posting Requirements )

I have identified that this is:
(1) Russian
(2) made in 1892
(3) Moscow
(4) the Assayer is AP in Cyrillic which is AR and possibly Aleksander Romanov (Moscow 1886-1894.

I am trying to find out who the maker is. The inititials are "П" & "Ж" in Cyrillic which I understand to be "P" & "Zhe". Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

Charles

[Qrt.S]

The marks on your item are more than dubious, what is it? One should always show at least two pictures, one of the object and another of the marks.

[charlesk]

Thank you for lettine me know. I attach a picture below.

[url]http://s15.postimage.org/g4hcw8f6z/IMAG0116.jpg

(admin photo edit - images too large - link only - see Posting Requirements )

Charles

[Zolotnik]

Hi -
that´s "Judaika phantasy" of the finest: either a rolling pin for baking kosher cookies or a holder for a reserve toilet paper roll from the last tsar´s datscha.

Regards
Zolotnik

[charlesk]

It is indeed a Jewish item, made to hold a Hebrew scroll. But what do you mean "Judaika phantasy of the finest"?

I also didn't understand that reference to the toilet paper holder.

Forgive my ignorance but I am not a dealer, I was simply offered this item and I am trying to research it.

Regards.

Charles

[Zolotnik]

Hi -
the whole object is phantasy, from the marks to the design - commonly called a fake - worthless and only made to cheat the unknowing = take his money and give him nonsense. Can you follow now? Ignorance always costs money!

Regards
Zolotnik

[charlesk]

Wow, I am amazed that there are experts that can spot this so easily, even from photos. Its a good thing I havent bought it yet. May I ask how you are able to notice this? Whats the giveaway?

Thank you very much.

Charles

[Zolotnik]

Hi -
if you want to buy antiques (every object 100 years old is antique) you should know the basics about it. If you buy precious metalls like silver or gold you should know the marks of the different countries. And you should be able to distinguish between authentic and fraud! If you can not do this, better stop buying things you do not understand - otherwise you will loose money and have a lot of unpleasant experiences.

Regards
Zolotnik

[charlesk]

What you say is true. I was looking for a contempary such item but a dealer offered me this one instead. May I ask you what the giveaway marks for this item was? I would like to revert back to the dealer and let him know what I think.

[Zolotnik]

Hi -
the marks are wrong (how they are placed), the maker ЛЖ did not exist in Moscow. As mentioned before: phantasy - or fake marks. By the way: the dealer know that it is a fake - you are the only one who think it is authentic - and you will not tell him something new!

Regards
Zolotnik

[charlesk]

Thank you.
In that case I would never buy from him again!
Is the style though correct for that period and region?

[Zolotnik]

Hi -

you are really persistant - maybe you do not understand what I write: PHANTASY-marks! They exist only in the phantasy of someone!!!!! The whole object, the marks and even the price the dealer is asking is PHANTASY!
Please do not ask what is phantasy :-)....

Regards
Zolotnik

[charlesk]

You have perhaps misunderstood what I asked. I meant the style of the item, not the marks.

[Zolotnik]

Hi -

The whole object, the marks and even the price the dealer is asking is

He who can read has an big advantage...

[charlesk]

How true. Have a nice weekend. Thank you for your help

[Qrt.S]

Ayayayay, I tried to put i nicely telling you that the marks are more than dubious. In harsh words that means FAKE! I'm very sorry but Zolotnik is absolutely right, there is nothing authentic regarding this item. I completely share his opinion, if you don't know what you are buying, don't buy it, leave it and instead learn the meaning of the marks and how the should be punched and what they look like.