Quick Question

[SusanWhite]

Hello, Everyone!

I may be confusing myself, but I have some sugar tongs and I can't tell if the maker is Thomas Shepherd or Thomas Streetin. Would one of you more experienced owls please help?







Many thanks for your time and expertise!
Susan
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[buckler]

The lower picture shows London assay marks for 1835/36.

Regret that I have been unable to upload the image of the mark shown in the middle picture, so am unable to check the makers mark.

Shepherd was free in 1769 and would have been in his late eighties when these tongs were assayed (if still alive !)
Streetin was still active in 1820, but would have been over 65 in 1835.
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[buckler]

Finally got your image of the mark, whchich shows it to be a cut cornered Roman Capital TS with a pellet. Computers hate me !

This could be Thomas Streetin's mark of 13th April 1820 - Grimwade does not illustrate it but adds it to his note on No 2930.
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[SusanWhite]

Dear Buckler,

Thank you very much for the help, I really appreciate it! I originally thought it was Streetin, but when I went to double check it and saw Shepherd's mark, I wasn't so sure.

Again, many thanks for your help....

Susan
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[MCB]

Hello Susan,
There was a Thomas Duffield Streetin christened in Holborn London in 1768. His father was Richard and that agrees with page 673 of Grimwade's biography for the silversmith.
There is a record in the 1841 Census of England of Thomas Streetin a silversmith aged 70 living at Great Sutton Street. The address again agrees with Grimwade's biography. The age Streetin gave is wrong by a little but, as seen before, not unusual in this era.
Jackson's page 257 has Streetin last mentioned in 1843.
As suggested in the previous posts it is doubtful Shepherd was still working in 1835. There seems no other silversmith than Streetin with this mark registered for 1835 and he looks to have still been working then. Clive's (Buckler) attribution looks spot on.
Mike
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[SusanWhite]

Hello again...

Thanks so much to Mike and Buckler for the help with the tongs!

Now, in looking at the photos in close up, it occurred to me that I think I'm reading the date stamp wrong.

Getting really close up, it is obvious that the leopard is crowned, which means it has to be pre-1822 (according to the info on the hallmarks page), which means what I thought was the small "u" for 1835, isn't right. Also, upon closer examination there's no little tip on the bottom of the box pointing downward, it's straight across.

So, then it would have to be the 1795 "u" ~ right? If so, is the duty stamp still William IV? I apologize for my lack of knowledge of the procession of British monarchs, but I'll take a chance on embarrassing myself and ask if it's therefore George III?

And, would it still be Streetin? If the date stamp is 1795, he'd have been 27 years old....

I am very grateful to all of you for sharing your knowledge and your willingness to help.

Susan
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[dognose]

Hi Susan,

No, the Leopard's head is uncrowned, I can see why you think it is, but I suspect that what you see on the top of his head is just a build up of old polish etc.

The shield used on the date letter on your piece is one that is often found on smaller items at this time.

Trev.
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[SusanWhite]

Hi, Trev!

Thanks for the help ... I wasn't looking only at the shadows, but there are some buffed out beads on the right side of the leopard which suggested a crown and I was also looking at the ears, which on the uncrowned leopard on the hallmarks page, look different from the stamp on the piece. However, I know you are right because I finally noticed the section on duty stamps at the bottom and the stamp is definitely Wm IV. Even though the box around the "u" doesn't have a point, it must be the 1835 date.

Again, thanks to everyone for the help, I really appreciate it.

Susan
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