Is this Thomas Willis

[roymacs]

Hi all. I have recently acquired a piece of silverware and need some help confirming and identifying the hallmarks on the base of it. Firstly here are the photos of it:


(click for a larger image)

(click for a larger image)

I have a few questions, so even if one could be answered, it would be much appreciated!

- Mainly, can anyone confirm that mark one in the middle is the stamp of Thomas Willis? If not then who else?
- What do the other two stamps mean and represent?
- What are those jagged lines represent?
- And lastly can these give an indication of the age?

Thanks for helping :-)

Alex

[Tongtwister]

Hi,

The maker's mark could be Thomas Wallis II - but I tend to think not, as there are too many curly bits for any mark of his that I have seen & the small bar across the vertical part of the "T" suggests it may actually be an "F"

The "PM" mark to the right is another maker's mark - so one or other will have probably been the maker & the other the retailer.

The mark to the left is not a British hallmark - not sure what it is, perhaps one of our experts in other country's marks may be able to help

The zig-zag lines are the assay scrape. These marks were made when the assay office scraped off some of the silver to test it.

[dognose]

Hi Alex,

Welcome to the Forum.

It's German, not British.

The maker's mark is on the right of your photo.

The 'FW' mark is a Prussian tax mark, see:
http://www.925-1000.com/Fgerman_marks_b1884_4.html

The 12 Lot mark=750/1000 standard, and was used in Szczecin/Stetin, now in Poland, I believe, hopefully others will confirm/deny.

Regards Trev.

[roymacs]

Hi again!

Thanks so much for the fast replies and the warm welcome!

Just before I ask any more questions will a moderator move my post to the German Silver Thread? I feel kind of bad that I have posted in the wrong section.

So now I know where it is made and the rough date, could anyone help with identifying the 'PM' maker?

Im sorry but im not sure what you mean by the '12 Lot mark=750/1000 standard', I'm only new to this kind of thing. Could you please explain a little further. I'm guessing that it is solid silver but was wondering if it has a gold plating on the inside? Is this a common thing?



Im not sure how hard it is to tell in the photo, but around the small scratches it looks as though its silver underneath.

Thanks so much once again!

[JAKJO]

Hi,

It is the town mark of Stettin / Szczecin (18th century) and the Prussian tax mark for old items. The maker is not known to me.

In my humble opinion the bowl seems to have been altered in the mid or late 19th century . The cast neo-roccoco flower decoration does not seem to fit.

Hope this helps!

Best regards/ JAKJO

[JAKJO]

For some curious reason I did not see your last post in this thread and the second picture of the gilded inside of your bowl, before answering.

I had this bowl from Bautzen, Germany in mind as reference and when looking att your new photo of the inside and the construction of the lid, I am not longer so sure that it has been altered.
(admin edit - see Posting Requirements )

The gilding of the inside makes completely sense if it was meant to be a salt cellar, because salt tarnishes silver badly but not gold.

The 12 Lot mark combined with the crowned head of a griffin tells us that it was made in Stettin of 12/16 pure silver (16/16-that is pure silver) or 750/1000 pure silver. Sterling silver, as you have heard of, is 925/1000 pure silver.

Hope this helps!

Best regards/JAKJO

[blakstone]

Although this "PM" mark isn't listed in Scheffler's Goldschmiede Mittel- und Nordostdeutschlands, which covers Stettin, I feel confident that the maker is Paul Mierck/Miercke (1714-1784), citizen 1734.

Scheffler gives his mark as P.MI/ERCK, but there weren't any other "PM"s working in Stettin at the time, and Mierck was certainly one of the major silverworkers there. It wasn't uncommon for a maker to use two marks - one large and one small - and Scheffler gives other contemporaneous Stettin examples of this. Given all this, I think the attribution to Mierck is all but certain.

[jackk]

This definitely looks to me like Szczecin mark from 1714-1751. I am attaching a scan from the book of Polish marks.
I will review another book dedicated to silversmiths of northern parts of Poland when I get back home. I will post my findings later.

[jackk]

Of course, this can be an unknown maker, can it not?

[Theoderich]

This definitely looks to me like Szczecin mark from 1714-1751. I am attaching a scan from the book of Polish marks.
I will review another book dedicated to silversmiths of northern parts of Poland when I get back home. I will post my findings later.

Dont look to Poland. In this time - Stettin was "Preussen" (Germany).

This mark is good for the Encyclopedia.

[Theoderich]

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stettin

>>1713 besetzte der preußische König Friedrich Wilhelm I. die Stadt und erwarb sie endgültig durch den Stockholmer Frieden von 1720. Die Preußen siedelten wichtige Verwaltungseinrichtungen an und bauten Stettin weiter zu einer Festungsstadt aus. Das Altpreußische Infanterieregiment No. 7 wurde nach Stettin verlegt und Stettin wurde so zur preußischen Garnisonsstadt. <<

1713 occupied the Prussian king Friedrich Wilhelm 1ST the city and acquired it finally through that stockholm peace of 1720: The Prussias settled important administration arrangements on and expanded Stettin further to a fort city. The Altpreußische infantry regiment nr. 7 was transferred after Stettin and became Stettin so the Prussian garrison city.