Alvin 'Raphael' Original vs Recast

[ellen324]

Hi

I recently purchased an absolutely gorgeous Alvin cold meat fork in their 'Raphael' pattern. It has "sterling" and the old Alvin mark on the back neck.

I had assumed it was c.1906 (the original casting), but I just read that Dansk has been recasting several of the original Alvin patterns, including 'Raphael'.

Two questions: First, does anyone know for sure if this pattern has been recast? And secondly, other than the obvious look of the piece, does anyone know of a reliable way of telling the difference between an original piece and a new one?

Thanks,
Ellen
.

[kerangoumar]

This would apply generally to all silver which has a current counterpart. PLease not I am not getting into construction which can be very lengthy.

You have to really look at the silver itself. If it is a new, recast item the silver will be bright and relatively spotless unless it has had a lot of living crammed into its short existence. But it still would not have that glorious sheen of age.

If it is a hundred-year-old fork there will be a network of fine scratches or polishing marks and areas especially in the engraving or ornamentation that were missed when cleaning. The tines or stem may be bent even a bit, there may be wear on the tines and in the handle where one would expect to find wear.

Silver being so soft, even with copper added, will wear off both in use and in cleaning.

You may even find water spots or those pesky little black gobs that are called silver sickness - you cannot get them off and they eventually crater the silver slightly.

And of course there will be the scratch when great-aunt Fenella demonstrated the softness of the metal by dragging the point of her diamond crystal ring over the back.

Now, if the silver was kept in a silver cloth, and in the dark, and possibly hauled out once a decade for decoration rather than use, the above might not apply. But in general use you do get these various expressions that add to the beauty and charm of silver that captivates so many of us.
.

[ellen324]

Thanks for your reply.

I appreciate your help very much, but I was really asking about whether anyone knew if Dansk had perhaps added or detracted something from the original casting - altered the casting in some very slight way so that there was a concrete way of determining old vs new.

My meat fork 'feels' old (has some of the characteristics you described), and because, in addition, I purchased it at an estate sale with a great deal of antiques circa the same age, I'm quite convinced that it is from the original casting. I just would like to KNOW that it is...

Thanks,
Ellen
.

[kerangoumar]

Many times the molds will have worn somewhat and there will not be as great definition of the newer design. If Dansk were going to recast an antique or vintage design it would be for some particular reason - popular demand, anniversary etc. Either there would be no difference from the original, as the tradition is being carried forward, or there would be a noticeable difference, in order to clearly differentiate the new.

THe people to ask this very specific question would be Dansk.
.

[admin]

Molds don't have a great deal of longevity, they degrade with use and there is quite a limited number of good castings that can be had from one. That being the case, the original model is always kept to make fresh molds from. When a recast is done by a major manufacturer, even 100 years later, it is a safe bet that they probably have the original model on hand to make a fresh mold from.
If a piece is recast using an antique piece of silver as the model for the mold, it will be measurably smaller than the original antique piece, shrinkage is involved in each step of the process.

Regards, Tom

ps. Forgot to mention, if Dansk was manufacturing an old Alvin pattern, I don't think they would be stamping an Alvin mark on product.
Of course there are plenty of other smaller concerns that might, but these small shop recasts generally look pretty feeble.
.