Can help me with this mark ....thanks

[bosateo]

[Traintime]

Mark 4 has the shape of Italian marks that went out of use after 1968: https://www.925-1000.com/Fitalian_marks_01.html

Could it be that the marks were re-worked or altered? Mark 2 looks like something was underneath.

[dognose]

Hi,

Welcome to the Forum.

These appear to be defaced Italian marks. I doubt we'll ever know why such action has been taken, but perhaps this was an unfinished piece acquired from a firm going out of business and finished by another?

Can any detail be made out from the hexagonal mark? Such a mark would not have appeared after around early 1971 at the latest. Perhaps the the piece was finally finished in 1973?

Just guesses I'm afraid.

Trev.

[Traintime]

Just as a note, not a comment on this particular object, but we have seen some old looking pieces that are suspiciously like re-castings or reproductions with some of the original marks left in place and appearing worn or incomplete. This is something to watch out for...the Russian trade alone is mind boggling, but other European pieces may be getting re-done too.

[dognose]

Just to clarify when that style of hexagonal fell into disuse. The law that changed the mark was indeed passed in 1968, but did not finish its progress through the Italian legal system until the end of 1970. Allowing time for the distribution of the new punches, we would be talking 1971 when the new mark makes its appearance.

It is also worth remembering that these punches were in the hands of the silversmiths themselves as the Italian system is one of self-regulation. When firms were wound up, the punches should be returned, but many, many of them are lost or cannot be accounted for every year.

Trev.

[amena]

The bowl seems a typical example of Brandimarte's products. Below an example of punching.




I can't imagine why the marks were erased.
Best regards
Amena

[dognose]

Hi Amena,

On your example we see the mark '1974' accompanied by the old style registration number mark. Is the '1974' not a year mark?

Can you enlighten us?

Trev.

[amena]

Yes, 1974 is the date of manufacture.
Brandimarte Guscelli was a brilliant and extravagant character and perhaps did not respect the regulations to the letter. His redundant punching was made to embellish the artifact.
He used this kind of punching at least until 1975, which I saw personally. I can't say if even later.

[dognose]

Hi Amena,

Many thanks for the explanation. I have seen in the past notices appearing in the 'Gazzetta Ufficiale' demanding the return of redundant punches, but perhaps these returns, or explanations of loses, were not enforced as may have been maybe expected.

Trev.

[amena]

Not only Brandimarte used the old style registration number mark after 1971

Best
Amena