Silver bowl

[Juke]

I have bowl with Finnish import marks (local reseller) and then a mark with S835 in an oval frame. I was thinking that the S835 (export mark?) might be from a Scandinavian country (Sweden, Norway or Denmark) as there is the S which means silver in the local language. The same goes for Scandinavian products which have been made localy as we know they are marked 830S in Denmark and Norway.







This is of course guessing so the bowl might be from a middle European country where the S835 mark is used (which I don't know).

I would like to get some ideas if it could be this way.

Regards,
Juhana

[Matulda]

It's definitely not made in Sweden, then it would have all the Swedish marks. If it was from Norway or Denmark it would have a makers’ mark. Besides, it ought to have been 830 instead of 835. My guess is Germany.

[Juke]

I believe that you have a good understanding of the Scandinavian silver and it is good to know that 835 silver have not according to your knowledge been used in the Scandinavian countries.

I agree that it could be German as 835 silver has been used there and the S might be the maker. However there is not the crown & crescent moon marks but I don't know how the German export of silver was marked. Maybe somebody has an understanding.

Reagrds,
Juhana

[Bahner]

Hello, Germany has neither import nor export marks. This could be German, the style might suggest a Hanau origin. Best wishes, Bahner

[Matulda]

Thank you for your input, Bahner. To clarify, German silver is not always hallmarked with the crescent moon and the crown. It is often just marked with the fineness and S for "silber" (not the maker).

[Juke]

As you both lean towards Germany and it sounds logically to be German silver then it can be said with good confidence that it is originally from Germany. Thanks for both of you for your replies and getting this one solved.

Regards,
Juhana

[Martine]

Hi, hello
I hope this can help you.

The easiest mark to find is the mark with the boat, very clear!
so with this we find the city of Helsinky, ( the boat is used till 1943)
so wa find that the country is Finland

The Essay mark for Finland since 1810 is = the small crown
Silver Standard : is 800 and something, with letter H ( i cannot go back to the forum page.)

and the date is given by the' letter with the number.'

More infos, go to the Tardy ' Poinçons d'argent', I think it has been translated in english.

I'll go back to the forum page and i'll tell you further

Silvery Yours
Martine

[Juke]

Hi Martine,

Thanks for your input. I actually knew already the Finnish import marks (I happend to be from Finland :) ) so I was looking for the S835 mark knowledge. The Finnish import marks are exactly:
- local retailer Kellomiehet Oy
- national mark
- 830 silver content
- city of Helsinki
- 1973.

We concluded that the S835 mark means that the bowl and the original maker is from Germany.

Regards,
Juhana

[Bahner]

Hello, to round this up - Thiele in his book on Hanau silver reproduces two marks used by Josef Oswald from Freigericht Neuses (Hanau region), but cannot identify the marks. One is the "813 H" for fineness, the other is "N 6" like the dateletter for 1942. Both come in a rectangle just like Finnish marks. So this bowl most likely is a Hanau product imported into Finland. Oswald may not be the maker, though: Oswald aquired almost a dozen other silver manufacturers from the region and it is unclear wheter the two marks are originally Oswald's or are marks of one of the aquired makers. Best wishes, Bahner

[Juke]

One more round :). Interesting to hear that even the Finnish marks has been imitated in Hanau. I have not heard this before. Commonly on this forum I have read of english silver marks imitated in Hanau but seems to be from other countries also.

In this case how the bowl has been made and sold is the following. Firstly the bowl was made in Germany (possibly Hanau) and struck with the S835 silver content mark. Then a Finnish retailer called Kellomiehet Oy(first mark KM Oy) imported (bought or preordered from this German silver producer) and struck in Finland the Finnish import marks. If I remember correctly the imported national hallmark is round in shape (as on bowl) and the locally produced national hallmark is shield in shape. Kellomiehet Oy was obliged to do this as all silver objects produced or imported to Finland had to have Finnish marks struck on it locally if/when these silver objects where sold in Finland. That is the reason why the bowl has the German mark and the whole set of Finnish marks.

Nowdays as Finland is part of the EU the silver marking system in other EU countries are accepted as they are so the silver objects imported to Finland from another EU country and sold here are not anymore obliged to be struck with Finnish silver marks.

Regards,
Juhana