Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

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Ringsmith
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Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Ringsmith » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:37 am

Hello! So glad to have discovered this forum. The 925-1000 site has already been of tremendous help in identifying some pieces I've collected, but I am coming up blank on my most recent find.

I acquired a set of 8 silver teaspoons at auction, in a burgundy velvet case, white satin lid interior. I've managed to ID the hallmark, which told me where they were from, and a time range: Austro-Hungarian, 1872-1922, produced in Pest, and that they are .800 silver.

Opposite the hallmark on the underside of the spoon bowl, is what I am assuming to be the silversmith's mark. It looks to me to be what i've discovered is called a "cylix", a shallow, two-handled drinking up with a round base/foot. I have not been able to find a silversmith in Austro-Hungary using this mark. Some research has come up with a Jewish silversmith, Herman Lowy, b.1785 (strange accent on the o that i can't replicate), who worked in Pest, was a community leader, and donated a silver chalice to a Lutheran Pastor in gratitude for assistance provided after flooding in Pest. Unfortunately, this was in 1838, and it seems unlikely that this man would still have been a working silversmith some 34+ years later, at almost 80 yrs of age.

Sorry if I'm rambling a bit. Trying to provide as much detail as I can from my own research thus far.

I hope this image link works... any help in ID'ing this silversmith would be greatly appreciated!

Image

Ringsmith
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Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:19 am

Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Ringsmith » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:38 am

and a pic of the hallmark, just in case i've mis-identified it...

Image

Ringsmith
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Ringsmith » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:49 am

deep zoom on the hallmark shows that it *could* also be an "R" for Kosice...

AG2012
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby AG2012 » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:54 am

Hi,
I opt for Pest
Regards

huszas76
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Location: Hungary, Budapest

Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby huszas76 » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:58 am

Hello!
Welcome to the forum!
I think, it's not an "R", it must be an "A", and I think, the maker is Jarosinski & Vaugoin.
Check the marks here: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=42254&p=119176&hilit=jarosinski#p119176
and here: viewtopic.php?f=38&t=35107&p=91639&hilit=Vaugoin#p91639
Best regards!
Krisztián

Ringsmith
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Ringsmith » Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:14 am

Thanks! great thread link! lots of good info there (bookmarked!)

So, the chalice/cylix does indeed look like Vaugoin, but he apparently didn't start using that mark until 1930, where the hallmark on the spoon indicates an earlier period

dognose
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Location: England

Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby dognose » Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:35 am

Hi Ringsmith,

Welcome to the Forum.

From memory, so don't hold me to it, the information about the 'Chalice' mark came from the Jarosinski & Vaugoin website. I've just had a look online and their site appears to have been updated, and I no longer see a reference to that mark, so our information may need updating.

If anyone has some concrete information as to when the Chalice mark was introduced, then please let me know and I'll edit in an update.

Trev.

AG2012
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby AG2012 » Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:05 pm

Hi,
Waltraud Neuwirth: the chalice from 1930 on.
Contradicting ``Diana`` head.
http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=35107
Unusual controversy for famous silversmiths.
Regards

dognose
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby dognose » Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:41 pm

Hi AG2012,

Many thanks for the information.

Trev.

Ringsmith
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Ringsmith » Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:01 pm

AG2012 wrote:Hi,
Waltraud Neuwirth: the chalice from 1930 on.
Contradicting ``Diana`` head.
viewtopic.php?t=35107
Unusual controversy for famous silversmiths.
Regards


Thanks! Perhaps I'll need to contact J-V directly and see if they can shed some light.

Rob The Ringsmith

Jean-Paul
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Jean-Paul » Wed Feb 22, 2017 6:59 am

Hi,
I´m the owner of Jarosinski&Vaugoin. I´m new in this forum, so please apologize any mistakes!
Just wrote your comment on our hallmarks.

Obviously our history is quite confusing!
As Mrs Neuwirth quotes in here book (Lexikon Winer Gold-und Silberschmiede und Ihre Punzen 1867-1922, L-Z) on page 258 - Karl Vaugoin started business in 1847 (or in 1846 as on page 258 "Louis Vaugoin")- this is the date which we are referring our foundation today.
The firm moved several times (Laimgrubengasse, Myrthengasse, Zieglergasse) and merged with the company of "Jarosinski" in the early 20th century.
Every owner at theat time used his specifc master-hallmark (e.g. C.V: Carl Vaugoin) above all our company´s mark (the goblet or chalice) existed already in the 19th century. Unfortunately we don´t know when this mark was registered.
As far as I know in the periode before the "Diana head" was marked (Alt Wien) we usually used just the initials. So I guess the chalice was invented around 1870-1875.

Best regards,
Jean-Paul

AG2012
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby AG2012 » Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:28 am

Hi Jean-Paul,
Thank you for contacting us. It`s very kind of you.
This is the proof ``the chalice from 1930 on`` is not correct because this tea strainer bears Diana head and Jarosinski&Vaugoin mark, both initials and chalice mark, as well as ``A`` for Vienna assay office.
It was made at the turn of 19th century and not later than 1910 as far as I can tell.
Thank you again for contacting us.
Kindest regards

Jean-Paul
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2017 5:23 am

Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Jean-Paul » Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:23 am

I thank you!
Whenever there is any question please contact us!
If someoen plans a trip to Vienna just write me and I´d be delighted to show you around our workshop and the small silver museum.
kind regards!
JP

AG2012
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby AG2012 » Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:40 am

Hello,
Appreciated.
Thank you again.
MfG

dognose
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Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby dognose » Wed Feb 22, 2017 12:40 pm

Hi Jean-Paul,

Welcome to the Forum.

Thank you very much for the information and the correction, I'll edit the details in soon. Thank you also for the kind invitation, I hope someday to take you up on your kind offer.

Trev.

Ringsmith
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Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:19 am

Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Ringsmith » Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:07 pm

Rediscovering this thread after losing track of my hobbies. :-) My apologies for the long absence.

Many thanks, Jean-Paul! Your detailed background definitely sheds light on these spoons. I've since acquired a very good USB microscope to get some very good shots of the hallmark and the maker mark. These are the only two marks I have been able to detect on the spoons, the chalice/calyx/goblet and the .800 hallmark (3-Diana-A).

Is there any way to determine the actual year of production?

Ringsmith
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:19 am

Re: Austro-Hungarian Silver Spoon set

Postby Ringsmith » Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:09 pm

and thanks to all who commented with links and information! Much appreciated!


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