French Silver Bowl

[joho]

Hi. Is anyone able to provide some information about this silver bowl, which I believe is French. It is circular and is on an applied circular foot. It has two cast handles in the form of a harp. It measures 180 mm across the handles and weighs 300 grams. It is inscribed around the rim: M JOLY . D . MONBY L' AN DE LA LIBERTIE. There is just one small hallmark near the rim. This seems to be a vase or some other device or item. Any information on the mark and the significance (if any) of the inscription would be much appreciated. Kind regards John

[fermiersgeneraux]

Hello,

I believe that your bowl is of french origine. The hallmark (small harpe) may be the Paris region discharge mark (decharge - indicating that the "tax" has been paid to the ferme generale, which was a necessary indication to legally sell or possibly resell the silver bowl). This particular mark is for older pieces (vieux ouvrages) for the period 1782-1789, which could mean that this piece was actually made prior to 1782.
The inscription could have been made starting in 1789 (by a silversmith or someone else, possibly the owner to commemorate the impeding events - french revolution). The inscription contains the name of the presumed owner of the bowl ("Joly D. Monby") and "L'AN DE LA LIBERTE (translating to "year one of liberty"), which refers to 1789, year of the start of the French revolution with the siege of La Bastille Prison.

Best regards,

[fermiersgeneraux]

The bowl could also have been made prior to 1780 because the small harpe discharge mark for older pieces was also in use during the 1780-1782 period (Henry Clavel I was the general farmer).

Best regards,

[joho]

Many thanks for sharing your knowledge - much appreciated. Nice that it has a link to the French Revolution! Is there any reason why there are no other marks or is this just a case of the maker not wanting to incur additional costs?

Best regards John

[fermiersgeneraux]

Sure thing, John.

If I had to make an educated guess as to why the other markings are missing, I can think of two somewhat plausible reasons:

1. Perhaps your bowl was made in the early to mid 18c (the small harpe mark was only used for "older" pieces), and was heavily used/cleaned, which could explain why all the marks rubbed off. In order to be resold in the 1780-1789 period, the bowl was checked for its silver content and/or a tax was levied, which could explain the small harpe mark. The new owner then made the inscription to commemorate the revolution.

2. Another explanation, could be that the original silversmith illegally kept the bowl for himself (although during some periods, the fermiers generaux had marks to denote such objects so that the silversmith was not taxed in a way that assumed a sale to a client), until he or someone else decided to sell it

These are of course just widely speculative guesses..

[fermiersgeneraux]

By the way, John,

I forgot to mention that in the 18c, this bowl or cup was traditionally known in France as "coupe de mariage" (translates to wedding cup/bowl)..In certain regions of France, notably in the region of Bourgogne, one would offer such a silver cup/bowl to newlyweds to drink from during the wedding ceremony. For less wealthy families, the cup/bowl was in tin. traditionally, the cup/bowl was engraved with the name of the bride or her initials. Following the wedding ceremony, the cup/bowl was later used during the baptism and communion ceremonies of the children. At the end of the wife's life, the cup/bowl was often placed in the coffin and filled with holy water.

Your piece is a nice example of a 18c French wedding cup/bowl. Enjoy it!

[joho]

Ah ha !! I've just noticed that where each handle joins the bowl there is an applied heart shaped plaque - I guess this confirms its marriage function. Many thanks for your explanations - I have always enjoyed the shape and good weight of the bowl but can now see it in a new and more interesting and meaningful light.

Best regards
John

[JayT]

Hello - There are two names on this loving cup: M superscript te Joly, probably an abbreviation for Marguerite, and D. Donby. The woman's name usually appears first. Joly is a family name, not a first name. Without seeing the object in person, I'd be very reluctant to say that it is an eighteenth century piece, given the single mark. Loving cups have been reproduced extensively because they are such charming and picturesque items

[fermiersgeneraux]

Jay T, you're absolutely right about the two names on this cup (Marguerite Joly and D. Monby). I had overlooked the picture and was going by John's transcription "M JOLY . D . MONBY L' AN DE LA LIBERTE".
if one was able to locate these two individuals on a genealogy website like geneanet, that may help further define the story on this piece.

[joho]

Many thanks both - much appreciated. I have just noticed that I left out the number 3 in the inscription which should read: L'AN 3 DE LA LIBERTE. I presume this would mean: YEAR 3 of the Revolution? Apologies! Best regards John

[fermiersgeneraux]

year 3 would presumably refer to 1791 (calendrier republicain/revolutionary calendar)
best regards,