Help with marks on old box

[modemgirlz]

I would appreciate any help I can get with the marks on this old box. The marks are very worn, but I belive they are of a lion walking right, a mans head and possible another man or womans head. I have also included the makers mark which looks to be F or T and C? I hope the pictures are clear enough to read. I would like to know the year, where it is from and the makers mark, and perhaps if known, is this a King, or Prime Minister or someone else on the silver piece? I don't know why but it looks Dutch to me, but I am guessing. * the last picture are of initals that were on the bottom of the box, perhaps the owners initals? ** I hope the pictures aren't to large, I did a direct link from the web hosting site***


http://img10.picsplace.to/15/silver_409.jpg
http://img7.picsplace.to/img7/25/silver ... es_025.jpg
.

[admin]

Hi,
I'm sure someone will provide a detailed answer, but in the meantime, have a look here ->
Dutch Hallmarks
Regards, Tom

ps. also have a look for a date letter on it.
.

[blakstone]

Definitely Dutch. The letter on Perseus' helmet looks like "B" for the Utrecht assay office, and the lion signifies the second silver standard of .833. Your final picture shows the date letter "F" (on the lid) for 1815. Unfortunately, I can't make out the initials and device (a mortar & pestle?) in the lozenge shaped maker's mark.
.

[modemgirlz]

Hello Tom and Blakstone,
Thank you both for your help! I thought the piece looked Dutch, but because the marks were hard for me to make out on my box, I really wasn't sure. I did look again at the Dutch Hallmarks and now that I know more about the marks, I can see that it is Dutch. I also thought the Maker's Mark was the F on the outside of the box. Thank you blakstone for correcting that for me. I am including another picture that I took of the lozenge shape for the Maker's Mark. I am not sure if this is any better. I think you maybe right it looks to be a mortar & pestle and I thought I saw an H but that maybe incorrect. Is there a Silversmith that would use a mortar & pestle for his mark? I thought maybe the design of the person on the box may help to identify the silversmith? BTW, as you can see the marks were upside down on the box, so maybe the Maker's Mark was stamped in the correct direction? Just a thought. Thank you both again for your help!
.

[modemgirlz]

Sorry, I think the server was down when I uploaded the picture. I will try again

.

[admin]

Hi,
I tried enhancing the image, but can't even figure out which end or side is the top. Just went over to the Dutch Maker's mark website at zilverkeuren.nl - it is accessible from our Dutch page. I discovered that if you add nothing to the search form and just click on "Zoek" all of their 295 marks show up. Quickly scanned through them all and found only 3 or 4 in lozenge shaped cartouches. Give it a shot, you may find a match.

Regards, Tom
.

[modemgirlz]

Tom,
You are so very kind to do all this work for me. Thank you so very much! I felt the same about the mark, I'm really not sure what way is correct. I just spent a long time going through the marks on the Dutch marks page. After looking for a long time and studing the shape, now I am not so sure it's a lozenge shaped mark, could be a square shape with some of it missing and on it's side. I am a novice at looking at these marks so I have no idea. I'm very grateful for all your work in trying to help me. I must say, I find researhing these marks very interesting! Thanks again.
Perhaps blakstone has better eyes then I do. He saw a B on Perseus' helmet and I am lucky to make out the helmet at all LOL
Regards, Kristina
.

[Doos]

Hi,

It is Dutch and the style and marks seem to indicate early 19th century.
Not sure where I should see an "f" though.

The lozenge shaped makers mark is a left over from the French occupation .. there are 1000's of them so you will be looking for a needle in a haystack without more information.
.