unknown date letter from Amsterdam

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R ingo
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Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:54 pm
Location: Germany

unknown date letter from Amsterdam

Postby R ingo » Wed Jun 09, 2010 5:05 pm

Hello,
can someone help me with this Duch date letter "X" from Amsterdam. The makers mark "RH" is Roelof Helweg, 1758 - 1843. A date letter "X" in Amsterdam can be 1782 or 1805.
The Lion Rampant silver guarantee mark looks on the side http://www.zilver.nl/zilverkeuren/find/page=1.html like the mark from the date letter series 1760-1784 but the city mark looks on this side like from the following series 1785-1807.

Kind regards,
Ringo

Image
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admin
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Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:52 pm

Postby admin » Wed Jun 16, 2010 7:16 pm

Hi R ingo,
Believe it is 1806. You can view a set of marks for the following year at the Museum Bredius website, see the tea canister for a matching Lion Rampant.
http://www.museumbredius.nl/zilver/z8.htm

Regards, Tom
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R ingo
contributor
Posts: 567
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:54 pm
Location: Germany

Postby R ingo » Fri Jun 18, 2010 4:04 am

Hello Tom,
I thank you for moving the article to this place and for the interesting link to the Museum Bredius website. I think, you are right with 1806. I never would have expected, that it is so difficult to date an object when there exist a date letter system.
I have looked for Amsterdam marks in the internet and I've found, that the design of the date letters in different series is unfortunately not very variabel.
Probably the there is a system in changing design of the city-or lion marks. But I have not yet found it. The oldest exampel of the same simple Amsterdam city mark with a diagonally cuted right upper corner I have found in the internet is from 1799 (in the time of the date letter series from 1785 to 1807).
Sometimes I read, that the form of the date letter mark (round or oval) was used for dating an objekt. I have two spoons with the same mark but the stem of one spoon later was made thinner and so the marks were compressed. The round date letter mark became oval. Later added and not compressed is the crowned O mark from 1807 for older silver.

Kind regards,
Ringo
Image
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dognose
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Location: England

Postby dognose » Fri Jun 18, 2010 5:00 am

Hi Ringo,

Had you seen these posts?

viewtopic.php?t=17208

viewtopic.php?t=16610

Regards Trev.
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R ingo
contributor
Posts: 567
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:54 pm
Location: Germany

Postby R ingo » Sat Jun 19, 2010 3:14 am

Hello dognose,
many thanks for the link to the posts. It is interesting and seldom to see images of the old silver smithes.

Kind regards,
Ringo
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