Part Makers Mark, Rubbed CH, GH, HD?

PHOTOS REQUIRED - marks + item
Essexboy Fisher
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Part Makers Mark, Rubbed CH, GH, HD?

Postby Essexboy Fisher » Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:40 pm

Hello my Dutch silver friends, I am hoping this is an interesting set of marks for you. I have bought a pair of maybe (you may know better) sifter spoons and one has what looks like a historic repair (opinions please).

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Spoons are about 16 centimetres (bit over 6 inches) long and regrettably there is no date mark on either spoon and the "head" is well rubbed. I could not make out the makers when I bought them and am not much wiser now.

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At first I thought the mark was "C" or "G"" H" under something but that lead to nobody on the Forum or on "zilverkeuren.nl".

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Current thought is that it is "HD" over something. Screening that on "zilverkeuren.nl" came to what is described as "Master stamp of Hermanus van Delden & Zoon in Zwolle, used from about 1820 to 1846" and that appears a possible match.
If this is correct could you explain this a little more please. I had thought my spoons would date second half of the 19th century and I see we have a post relating to Hermanus van Delden & Zoon showing a simple conjoined "HD" mark for the them there.

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=24848&p=60247&hilit=delden#p60247

What would contribute to no date mark on my spoons? Would they have been associated with another larger item that did have a complete set of marks on.
Please do put me right if I have incorrectly sifted the information.

Fishless

oel
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Re: Part Makers Mark, Rubbed CH, GH, HD?

Postby oel » Mon Sep 12, 2022 7:51 pm

Two well used sugar sifter spoon, both stem shoulders bowl repaired reinforced .
In the Netherlands (silver) sugar sifter spoons have been in use for a long time. The first were made about 1710. At that time In the Netherlands one could only buy sugar loaves in the shop, this is granulated sugar compressed into bread moulds. The sugar loaves were made from syrupy brown cane sugar, imported from tropical countries and refined in the Netherlands. The sugar loaves were sliced and sieved to be served in trays and bowls. Icing sugar is sugar pounded in a mortar.



Hi, indeed the maker’s mark of Hermanus van Delden & Zoon (Son), registered in the city of Zwolle.
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Hermanus van Delden born in Zwolle, circa 1792, died Zwolle 1858. From 1846 to 1858 the company continued under the name H. van Delden en Zoon. Marks used HD conjoined in different variants with and without sickle/device, around 1814 till around 1848. HD above 31,in seven different variants with and without dots etc, used 1814 till 1858. And the marks v.D. used 1829-1846, VD2, and VD above 2, used 1858-1866.

The missing year letter, the mark of the assayer. You might find a tiny little year letter in the sifter’s bowl. If not polished away or lost under repair. To prevent fraud marks were often spread over an object. When made out of one piece, the marks on the handle, when soldered from several pieces the marks to spread over the parts.

For more information about his work see:
https://www.google.com/search?q=Hermanu ... 6&dpr=1.25


Peter.

Aguest
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Re: Part Makers Mark, Rubbed CH, GH, HD?

Postby Aguest » Tue Sep 13, 2022 4:10 am

:::: In my example, right where the handle meets the bowl, the handle suddenly diverges into two smaller parts and these are attached to the bowl, it is such a delicate and fragile design such that one of the smaller parts has broken off, it seems as if your handle follows a similar pattern but I cannot be certain due to the repair. :::::

:::: Either this design is too delicate for its purpose or people are (improperly) using it for something other than the sifting of granulated sugar. ::::

:::: Maybe people started using these as pea strainer spoons? ::::

oel
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Re: Part Makers Mark, Rubbed CH, GH, HD?

Postby oel » Tue Sep 13, 2022 5:22 am

Here is another sifter made by Hermanus van Delden, year letter for 1823, thin gauge, weight only 26 gram, length 15 cm, and marked where the handle meets the bowl.
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A Google search; zilveren suikerstrooilepel will reveal more.

Peter

Essexboy Fisher
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Re: Part Makers Mark, Rubbed CH, GH, HD?

Postby Essexboy Fisher » Tue Sep 13, 2022 3:40 pm

Thank you Peter and Aguest for the identification confirmation and insightful comments. Aguest, I won't complain too much about the mis-use of the sifters as if they were in A1 condition they would unlikely be in my ownership. Additionally, in the past, I know I have ruined good screwdrivers by using them as chisels. I looked again as you suggested Peter and the images below are all from one of the spoons.

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I am thinking this could be the "x" for 1832. I am sure regular Dutch silver "students" will recognise what letter it is straight away. I can see the "dot" near the letter. Is that part of the letter image? Did I read somewhere that a "dot" was used if there was a change of "Assay Master" during a year?
Thank you.

Fishless

oel
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Re: Part Makers Mark, Rubbed CH, GH, HD?

Postby oel » Tue Sep 13, 2022 6:16 pm

Hi Fishless,

I believe you are right again. In my opinion we are looking at the first alphabet, the year letter .X (script). In this case the dot, at the bottom, is part of the original year letter, and perhaps for (easier) identification.
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Indeed until 1931 the assayers were personally liable for mistakes in the results of their work. Until 1931 year letters were considered to be their responsibility marks. When in the course of a year the assayer of a certain office was succeeded by another one, as a consequence the year letter of that particular office were provided with a distinguishing mark. Usually it was a dot, but commas, crosses and stars also occurred. There are a few year letters bearing two dots; the result of two changes of assayer within a single year.

Peter.


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