Tea Strainer with Sailing Ship Mark and HIB&S.. Denmark?

[kerrberry77]

I'm trying to get more information about this tea strainer. It is marked with HIB & S, with two, three masted sailing ship marks. After searching the forum I found that the town of Tonder (Tondern?) in Denmark used the ship mark before 1863. This strainer measures about 19cm long and 6.3cm wide. (7.5" by 2.5") and weighs 41 grams. There are some scratched in numbers on the short handle, and some letters on the other end. Could this really be from the 1800's? Is it from Denmark? Is anyone familiar with HIB & S? I welcome any insights. Thank you!

Kerrie

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[dognose]

Hi Kerrie,

You will have a far greater chance of getting a response if you embed your images. Very few people will click on such links.

Trev.

[kerrberry77]

Thanks, I wanted to do that but I couldn't get it right

[kerrberry77]

[kerrberry77]

[WarrenKundis]

Good evening,

Yes this does seem to be the city mark for Tonder (Danish) or Tondern (German) although I have never seen one so crisp. The makers mark HIB & S I have had no luck with. On the scratch mark on the other side may have been placed there by a previous owner since it is not in the usual pickgravering or tremblering style dot engraving seen in Denmark and Norway. The mark appears to show a upper case script letter F1868. Do remember that that scratch mark could have been added at anytime and does not necessarily indicate the period of manufacture of the strainer itself.

Hope this helps.
Warren

[kerrberry77]

Thank you for the reply, Warren! I wonder why this mark is so crisp. I have seen only several examples of the Tonder mark and they look rather blob-like. It is interesting that there are two ship marks, also. Hopefully one day we can shed some light on the HIB & S maker.

[Hose_dk]

I dont click on links so I have not seen it
Tønder was German from 1864 to 1920

[kerrberry77]

I posted a couple of embedded pics, too. Thanks for the info about Tonder

[WarrenKundis]

I believe that Hose is asking for further shots, like the scratch mark on the back and the side profile.

And yes as Hose will tell you not unusual to see two, three, or even four city marks on Danish provincial silver. You can review that material here in older posts. Interested to hear what else he has to add.
Enjoy!
Warren

[kerrberry77]

[Hose_dk]

Sorry but maker I cannot find.
The patern is "Dobbelt riflet" a very old pattern. "Det Nielsenske bestik" was made in 1785 and was of that pattern.

the scrach is August 4th 68 --- 4/8 68. The scratch could be 1968 as well as 1868. It could very well be set in 1968 but tea stainer is older. This to say that its not by definition 1868.
As we cannot find the makers mark - my guess is the German period.

To make it more confusing I think the ship is not Tønder but Helsingør. Its a bit difficult to see details.
The vessel was used in Helsingør - Nykøbing Falster, Nysted and Kerteminde as well as Tønder.
And also - in Sweden the vessel was used. I think in Helsingborg.

Not that it brings us anywhere else. I would go for Helsingør.

[kerrberry77]

That is very interesting information, thank you Hose! I will look for more about Helsingør. I do have a better close up of the marks if it helps.

[Hose_dk]

its difficult. There are a lot of different city marks and not all of them are listed in Bøje. Many are simply unknown. So unless someone recognize the makers mark. I am in Northern Sealand.

During my sleep .. I have decided 68 refers to 1968. Its an owner that has made this on an older piece. If we have had the situation 1868 he would have used the prik for this. So the date is new.

[kerrberry77]

It is very interesting to me, each city having its own mark. Helsingfor has a similar crest even today with a ship on the water. I think I have seen the prik marks on other pieces, like the numbers are written with dots. I found this heavily tarnished at a second hand sale in the north east of the US, at least a decade ago. It is amazing to think how it got there. :)

[Hose_dk]

its not Helsinki - its Denmark allright, with the german possible twist.

[kerrberry77]

Right, not Helsinki, but possibly Helsingor,in Denmark

[WarrenKundis]

Thank you Hose, always good to hear your feedback on what we are looking at.

While trying to locate other examples of the Helsingor city mark, which I actually did not find on the internet in my initial search, it reminded me of a search I made a few months ago when trying to nail down an unknown city mark that turned out to be Vimmerby Sweden.

Did not find a match at Svenska silverstamplar, good site, then started looking at city crests on wikipedia and Hallmarks encyclopedia. Was able to finally locate Vimmerby. Also found a number of other examples on Auktionshuset and Auction Network Sweden AB. Are there other Auction sites in your experience that could assist in examining marks for Helsingor, Nykobing & Falster, Nysted, and Kerteminde, whether Danish, Swedish, Finnish, Norwegian, German, etc.

That last question may prompt the start of a new thread where members can recommend silver sites or auction sites in various languages where examples of markers marks, city marks, date marks, etc can be observed and identified. Any helpful hints and terms on how to navigate sites that do not translate into English would be extremely helpful.

A very good evening to you both.
Warren