V.Morozov maker's marks?

PHOTOS REQUIRED - marks + item
Atlas
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V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Atlas » Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:31 am

Hi,
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So help would be appreciated with identifying the Morozov maker's marks on the silver chamberstick in the picture below ( N.B. in cyrillic? The assay-master's marks is Jakov Lyapunov, St.P.,1899-1903) if you please.
Image
Regards,
- Atlas -

Atlas
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Atlas » Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:33 am

Height is 11cm.

Qrt.S
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Qrt.S » Tue Oct 29, 2019 10:49 am

Unfortunately НБ (Latin NB) is unknown to name. There are too many alternatives in St.Petersburg...

Atlas
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Atlas » Wed Oct 30, 2019 4:34 am

Ok. Thanks, anyhow, for your effort Qrt.S.
Best regards, Atlas.

Goldstein
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Goldstein » Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:12 am

Hi -
the Morozov marks are fakes and later added. By the way, Morozov only made cutlery.....

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Qrt.S
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Qrt.S » Fri Nov 22, 2019 12:56 pm

@Goldstein

Where from have you got the silly idea that Morozov made only cutlery???? The firm of Morozov made (cloisonné) enamel works, cigarette cases in gold, silver ware in general even jewellery...you name it, but also cutlery of course. By the way, "cutlery" are tools for serving, preparing and especially for eating food, Read the text you show, it says "tea glass holder, cup" those are not called "cutlery". Take as well a look and read the link below:
https://lermontovgallery.ru/spravochnik ... e-morozov/

If you don't want read the whole text, you will find below an extract of the main point.

Торговый дом «И.Е. Морозова» на протяжении всего периода существования имел достаточно многообразный ассортимент изделий. Активно велась торговля бриллиантовыми, золотыми, серебряными вещами, предметами из бронзы и мельхиора, туалетными принадлежностями, лампами, часами, охотничьими и рыболовными принадлежностями, оптическими, церковными вещами, альбомами, также перчатками и прочими «многоразличными предметами».
«Веерница» (Серебряная с позолотой сумочка-футляр для хранения веера), ТД «И.Е. Морозовъ», Российская Империя, Санкт-Петербург, 1894 год.
«Веерница» (Серебряная с позолотой
сумочка-футляр для хранения веера),
ТД «И.Е. Морозовъ»,
Российская Империя,
Санкт-Петербург, 1894 год.

Графин для крепких напитков. Граненый хрусталь в литой серебряной золоченой оправе. ТД «И.Е. Морозовъ», Российская Империя, Санкт-Петербург, 1899-1901 гг.
Графин для крепких
напитков. Граненый хрусталь
в литой серебряной
золоченой оправе.
ТД «И.Е. Морозовъ»,
Российская Империя,
Санкт-Петербург, 1899-1901 гг.

Особую известность и статус придворного поставщика фирма Морозова получила за счет столового серебра и вещей, в том числе, церковных, выполнявшихся для Кабинета Его Императорского Величества. Изделия Морозова отличались высоким художественно-эстетическим уровнем при оптимальной цене.
Набор столового серебра в родном футляре. Ложки кофейные. ТД «И.Е. Морозовъ», Российская Империя, Санкт-Петербург, 1894 год
Набор столового серебра
в родном футляре.
Ложки кофейные.
ТД «И.Е. Морозовъ»,
Российская Империя,
Санкт-Петербург, 1894 год

Goldstein
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Goldstein » Fri Nov 22, 2019 2:47 pm

Maybe it escaped your attention that I speak of B.MOPO3Ob - the article is about И.E.MOPO3Ob!
Many fakes and fake marks...
The easiest way is to show some real enamel objects + the marks!

No statement to the fake mark of B.MOPO3Ob.....just the known smokescreen.
Do you realize that your behavior ruins the Russian forum? All the valuable posters have left already.

I wish you much luck with your one-man-show!

AG2012
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby AG2012 » Fri Nov 22, 2019 2:49 pm

Hi,
There should be at least one more set of marks,plus secondary marks on the handle (not obligatory,though) but the base and chamberstick itself should bear two sets of marks.If they are missing the item is definitively assembled from two different pieces not belonging together.
Regards

Qrt.S
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Qrt.S » Sat Nov 23, 2019 1:23 am

Vladimir Ivanovitsh Morozov was Ivan's son. He worked in the workshop of firm Morozov with the other masters. After his father's death in 1885 he continued the business to 1917. The point here is, however, that he made silver tableware and not only cutlery like you claim. Reread what Postnikova says in her book and don't distort facts.

As to who is destroying the site in none of your business. Let the readers decide on that.

Qrt.S
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Qrt.S » Sat Nov 23, 2019 1:26 am

@AG2012

The candlestick is made around the turn of the century. At that time it was no longer mandatory to punch marks on all detachable parts. Sometimes they carry marks but not always.

Goldstein
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Goldstein » Sat Nov 23, 2019 8:21 am

If it is as you write - B. MOPO3Ob only made Podstakanniki and Stakantschiki - but no cutlery (according to PL)! But only cutlery from him is known....
I never in 50 years of collecting have seen the by PL mentioned objects - but tons of cutlery!

So it is up to you to show some of these objects. Blah, blah is not counting - facts are important!

How about the fake mark you accepted as authentic? Maybe you should take back your inadmissible statement and apologize!

Instead, you are interfering everywhere, trying to teach, insult and discredit people who know more than you.
Even AG2012, who has a remarkable and universal knowledge, is scolded by you like a stupid schoolboy.

I will stop posting again - only if you make blatant mistakes like so often, I will intervene.

Qrt.S
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Qrt.S » Sat Nov 23, 2019 11:48 am

@Goldstein
Here we go again. Learn English before you start to criticize. I never said BM made only stakanchiks (a smaller beaker and note the spelling "стаканчик") etc.. What I said is that he made TABLEWARE and not only cutlery. That he is known for. You seem not to know the difference so look it up! If you still don't get it, note that a stakanchik is tableware but not cutlery. You drink from it. A tea glass holder is not either cutlery.
Moreover, it is commonly noticed here that almost everything showed here or not in your possession is according to you faked. Remember your "fake free" collection...was it? It is a shame that you have this bad attitude. With your skills you should know better.... Maybe you got this attitude from your "friendly Russian friend" like last time? Anyway, who makes mistakes? Let the readers judge that. Feel free to intervene whenever you like. I couldn't care less and I don't think the readers do it either, but you could leave your cheeky behavior elsewhere. It would be much appreciated. As I already said you have you have a lot of skills but also too much of bad attitude...unfortunately.

Goldstein
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Goldstein » Sat Nov 23, 2019 10:50 pm

Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak!

Atlas
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Atlas » Thu Jan 16, 2020 7:25 pm

@AG2012
There are more marks on the other parts as well...I will try to take pic's of those in the near-future (, as soon as I find time, which is not ear-marked with more primary operations ).
Regards, Atlas.

Atlas
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Re: V.Morozov maker's marks?

Postby Atlas » Fri Jan 17, 2020 4:24 pm

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