Help with 14K gold hallmark

[tonius]

Hi,

I'm new to the forum and have trouble identifying gold hallmark on a gold cigarette case from the 1920s-1930s. The middle mark appears as crescent and crown as seen on some German silver items. However, I'm not familiar with German gold hallmarks. I'm adding a couple of photos.




Thank you very much for your information.

Toni

[dognose]

Hi Toni,

Welcome to the Forum.

See Louis Kupperheim at: http://www.925-1000.com/Fgerman_marks_a1884_5.html

The centre mark appears to be the Canadian gold mark rather than the German one.

Please remember in future posts to keep your images to within the 7" (18cm) guidelines.

Trev.

[tonius]

Hi Trev.

thanks for your reply. I believe the Canadian hallmark to be maple leaf within the letter C but this here is clearly a crown. If someone can recognize the maker from the initials it'll be great. Thanks again to all.

Toni

P.S. The site wouldn't take my photos initially as being too large, so I had to reformat them within the 1000 pixels limit and they showed fine so I figured they are in compliance. Will keep in mind the 7" limit for future posts.

[dognose]

Hi Toni,

The Canadian gold mark in the 1930's was, to my knowledge, a crown within a 'C'. The German gold mark was a crown within a circle.



Out of interest, have you ever had the item tested?

Trev.

[tonius]

Hi Trev.

thanks again. I wasn't aware of this older Canadian hallmark, it does look something like it. Only difference is that according to your reference the Canadian proof is 583.3 and mine is marked 585. Not sure how strict they were about these values at the time. I've not had it tested but I bought it from a reputable London auction house and they have tested it as 14K, they also guarantee the onyx and diamonds gemstones on the case. Do you have any concerns by looking at it or you're just asking? I don't have it in my possession yet, once it is delivered, I'll have it tested.

Toni

P.S. I'll upload photos of the whole case tomorrow.

[dognose]

Hi Toni,

To be honest, I don't think this is the Canadian mark, I think this is the German silver mark. In Germany, the gold/silver marks are not applied by an assay office, but by the maker's themselves, using their own punches, this is why we see such a wide variety of this style of mark.

Best case (excuse the pun) scenario is that it was simply the wrong mark applied, doubtful perhaps, but not impossible. As you say the piece has diamonds set into it, then they are rarely to be found on silver.

Worse case scenario, it is gold plated silver with the '585' mark over-striking the silver standard mark to deceive.

But perhaps neither of these, let us wait for photos of the whole item and hopefully the thoughts of those with better knowledge of German marks.

Trev.

[tonius]

Hi Trev.

my theory is somewhat similar to yours. If this piece was commissioned to a silversmith who usually doesn't work with gold, they'll only have the silver punches, or he might have mistakenly put the wrong punch. The case has wear and scratches on the inside and on the outside and I think if it was plated the color beneath will show silverish. I'm inserting more photos. Thanks to everyone for sharing their opinions.

Toni