Hammer (in script) Viel. or Kiel. or Viiel. (in script)

[sspencer]

I have a set of spoons that are marked: a triangular mark with notched edges and a circular swirl or flower or something in the center, followed by the name Hammer, in script, in a rectangular shape, followed by Viel. or Viiel. or Kiel., in script and in a rectangular shape. The last mark/name appears to end in a period, and has a rather elaborate first letter which could be a K, or could be a V followed by the a large loop starting a lower case I, or it could actually be Vii. The marks are very strongly/deeply stamped.

I have a number of books on silver marks and none of these are familiar. The spoons do not appear to be plated, but they also don't have any standard mark I'm familiar with so they could be plated or a low standard of silver.

The Viel./Kiel. sounds vaguely Germanic or easter European to me.

There are initials and a date, 1804, hand pricked on the back of the spoon necks, but I don't know if that is truly a date or someone's attempt at an identifier number. The design is a very simple handle with a modified rat tail at the bowl.

Any assistance in identification would be greatly appreciated.

[blakstone]

Are these the marks you mean?



These are from the German Schleswig-Holstein city of Kiel (see this thread). Several cities in the region used the nesselblatt as their mark, but the word "Kiel" on your piece seems to settle the matter.

The maker is Anton Riegard Hoyer; as you can see, his mark - actually "H . . . r" - with ellipses between the H and r - definitely looks more like "Hammer" than "Hoyer". Little is known of him, but that he was apprenticed in nearby Preetz to J. P. Herzberg, and is listed there in the 1803 census. He was shortly thereafter moved to Kiel, where he worked primarily as a spoonmaker.

Hope this helps!

[sspencer]

Thank you very much for the information. Late last night I found the triangular shaped mark for Kiel listed in my book of foreign marks, however it seems that the notched edges of my mark are much more regular than those shown in the book or in your email, plus mine definitely has a circular symbol (almost like a bulls eye target of a circle, with a circle in it, with a dot in that) in the center of the triangle.

The K (that looks a lot like a V) is more clearly a K in your Kiel mark, but it is very similar. However the rest of the the letters of Kiel are much straighter and more regular than in the sample mark.

And, when we get to H...r I just have a really hard time seeing that as something other than "Hammer". While the center mm might be ellipses (not sure what you mean by ellipse, but I assume it is a curved stroke) it just REALLY looks like an 'a' at the front and an 'er' at the end. I can understand them substituting something other than a 'y' in the middle, as the decending stroke of the 'y' wouldn't really fit in the rectangular cartouche or frame around the name. And I can even see that an 'o' might look like an 'a' when followed by an "ellipse". I would say, at the very least, that is is H()))))(r if we were going to turn what looks like 'amme' into ellipses.

On the other hand, he was primarily a spoonmaker and the Kiel marks do seem to match better than any other marks. I'm just surprised that mine are so much sharper and clearer than other samples would be. Perhaps the samples are drawings that weren't very well done...I've never been sure about those old European marks (how they get a copy for the books).

I will go to the thread you mention and see what I learn there and, again, thank you very much for replying!