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Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 11:49 am
by Italiansilver
Hi all,
I have this "drageoir" in perfect french style.
I have found some examples very very similar all perfectly french marked.
Mine has three marks, two are very worn and one (800) is pretty new.
My idea is that the 800 is a new mark made when the drageoir has been repaired (there are some indication of small restorations), but the other two have no french marks.
I took some pictures , that are not the best, but are the best of what I can do.

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the firs mark seems an horseshoe with a letter inside, the second totally unreadable...

and this is one example found in the net
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Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 3:41 am
by huszas76
The second mark seems a german hallmark, crescent moon and crown.
If it is right, maybe could be easier to find the maker.
Best regards!
Krisztián

Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:06 pm
by Italiansilver
good hint I'll try to search.

the second mark to me was resembling to an arm with fist with beside something that a lily :-)

Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:23 pm
by Italiansilver
huszas76 wrote:The second mark seems a german hallmark, crescent moon and crown.
If it is right, maybe could be easier to find the maker.
Best regards!
Krisztián

would say great!!!!
I was looking to the relief part of the mark!!!!! Not to the impressed!!!!!!!
A very similar horseshoe mark is present in the german unidentified marks section
thanks

Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:47 pm
by Italiansilver
Oberländer P. GmbH - Hanau
without any doubts
http://www.silvercollection.it/GERMANMA ... OTObis.jpg

many many thanks

vary happy to have found the origin after some years but a bit disappointed to discover that is Hanau silver

Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 3:58 pm
by AG2012
Hi,
Hufeisen (Horseshoe) mark appears with AHK, not necessarily Hanau.
Rostock might be the candidate,too (the mark on a souvenir spoon from that town),an assumption,though.
Regards

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Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 4:27 pm
by Italiansilver
thank you for your effort,
but, for the moment, it seems that all my three marks are very resembling to the example in the link...

Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 4:46 pm
by Italiansilver
anyway are not pseudomarks, because there is the regular crown&crescent moon, am I right?

Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 5:51 pm
by AG2012
By definition``Pseudo marks`` resemble old marks and it's difficult to say if they were used to deceive because many Hanau items,beside pseudo marks,had crescent and crown and millesimal fineness that absolutely excluded earlier centuries.
Regards

Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:59 am
by Italiansilver
Hi I was meaning that there aren't marks resembling ancient marks.
Are not regular german hallmarks + maker's mark?
Am I right?

Re: Help to identify origin and age of this drageoir

Posted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 9:06 am
by AG2012
Right, full set of regular German marks on this item.