E. BILLS on buckle of c1745 - Edward Bills

1700 - 1830

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buckler
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E. BILLS on buckle of c1745 - Edward Bills

Postby buckler » Fri Sep 04, 2009 7:36 pm

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This one has eluded me for some years. How difficult should it be when a mark has the full name !
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Image
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Found on a small buckle with a London Lion Passant Guardant of the 1740 -1756 form. The buckle is stylistically early and I doubt if it's any later than 1745. It was bought as a pair with another very similar 1740- 1756 buckle - which appears to have been made with the same mark, but then overstamped by another silversmith The newer mark SE has the same "E" as on this mark .

I've tried to make the letters fit for Edmund King , but failed .
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silverly
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Postby silverly » Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:42 pm

It may just be an over active imagination, but I see E Bills as a possibility.
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buckler
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Postby buckler » Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:56 pm

Thanks.
I have had this idea from someone else, (unless you are MB) and it seems a good suggestion. However no such person is listed in Grimwade. I have added it to my list of guys to look up on the Goldsmiths Hall records .
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dognose
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Postby dognose » Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:08 pm

Edward Bills, St Martins Lane, in business 1735.

Trev.
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buckler
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Postby buckler » Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:20 pm

Thats marvellous Trev. What is the source please ?
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dognose
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Postby dognose » Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:32 pm

Hi Clive,

Sorry not to have noticed it earlier, but it was not until silverly cracked the lettering and revealed the name that I understood it.

Edward Bills is noted on page 107 of The London Goldsmiths 1200-1800 by Ambrose Heal.

Regards Trev.
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buckler
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Postby buckler » Thu Mar 18, 2010 10:19 am

Sorry Trev , I never thought to check Heal! I suspect that the St Martins Lane is the City one by London Bridge, which makes me think this may have been a retailer's rather than a lost register mark. Pity that the other, very similar buckle with the SE overstamping this one is not the understamp! But I still feel that the SE is a lost register mark of Samuel Eaton ( first recorded mark 1736, last 1767) of Huggins Alley (later Lane)

Anyhow thanks to Silverly and Dognose we have a RESULT ! I am 99% certain this mark is that of an Edward Bills.
Now to check him out at Goldsmiths Hall ! He does not seem to have trade card anywhere, although searching for Bills in a trade card list is difficult!

There are several Edward Bills known for the period, but none are silversmiths. One, whose will was proved in 1784, was London cabinetmaker
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Re: E. BILLS on buckle of c1745 - Edward Bills

Postby buckler » Sat Mar 16, 2013 6:54 pm

Grimwade p.289
20 September 1736
Incuse mark of BILLS entered by Edward Bills of "The Hand and Bucket" , St Martins Court


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