Wang Hing Export?

PHOTOS REQUIRED - marks + item
Granmaa
co-admin
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 9:32 am
Location: London
Contact:

Wang Hing Export?

Postby Granmaa » Sat Jun 06, 2009 6:05 pm

Did Wang Hing use pseudo marks on some of his silver? The marks on this spoon are good but definitely dodgy.

Miles

Image Image
.

admin
Site Admin
Posts: 2526
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:52 pm

Postby admin » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:39 am

Hey Miles,
Sure do look funky, but Wang Hing worked in the very late 19th/early 20th century and this is a few decades later than fiddle spoons or when imitation British pseudos were in common use. Had no luck in finding an earlier WH in China Trade silver. Something about the demeanor of this lion is making my gut scream CANADA!, can't put my finger on what it is, but it might worth having a look up there.

Regards, Tom
.

dognose
Site Admin
Posts: 32387
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 12:53 pm
Location: England

Postby dognose » Sun Jun 07, 2009 3:56 am

Hi Miles and Tom,

Agree with Tom, these look like North American pseudos, similar, but not the same, as these two possibles:

Image

Image

Chinese export examples appear, most often, to incorporate the Leopard's Head into their versions. Supposing this to be the case, and they are North American, then with the engraving done in the English style, then Canada could well be the origin of this spoon.

Regards Trev.
.

Granmaa
co-admin
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 9:32 am
Location: London
Contact:

Postby Granmaa » Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:52 am

Thank you both. Canada seems about right.
These are possibly the best colonial pseudo marks I've seen.

Miles
.

paulh
contributor
Posts: 377
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 6:02 pm
Location: Cheshire, England

Postby paulh » Sun Jun 07, 2009 7:40 am

Hello Miles,

In John E. Langdon’s book on Canadian Silversmiths, there is a William Hunter listed as working in Quebec around 1805. This would fit with the style of the spoon, but the mark illustrated is a crown, a lion passant and the initials “WH”, with no date letter type mark.

Just another line of thought. Have you considered the possibility of it being a West Country piece. There was a William Pope in Plymouth Dock using a similar mark from around 1819 and it is not uncommon to find pieces, from that period, whose maker omitted the Exeter town mark. This would fit with the “f” being a date letter for 1822.

Paul.
.

2209patrick
co-admin
Posts: 3570
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:53 pm
Location: Land of Lincoln, USA

Postby 2209patrick » Sun Jun 07, 2009 11:21 am

Hello everyone.

My first thought was Canadian too, but had no luck finding your marks.

Unitt's book shows a period between the W and H in their drawing of William Hunter's mark.
Does not show what pseudo marks were used.

"Silversmiths and Related Craftsmen of the Atlantic Provinces" by Donald C. Mackay shows a WH mark for William Hillman of St. John, New Brunswick..
Problem is it has a pellet between the letters.

Pat.
.

paulh
contributor
Posts: 377
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 6:02 pm
Location: Cheshire, England

Postby paulh » Sun Jun 07, 2009 1:51 pm

There seems to be a discrepancy in the illustration of William Hunter’s mark. The photograph in Langdon’s does not show a pellet between the W and the H.

Paul
.

Granmaa
co-admin
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 9:32 am
Location: London
Contact:

Postby Granmaa » Sun Jun 07, 2009 6:06 pm

Thank you all for your responses. I was thinking more, Paul, about your suggestion of Exeter origin, and William Hope does fit nicely with the potential 1822 date. He started in 1816 and carried on to 1833.
I'm embarrassed, after writing an article on 1797-1810 Exeter hallmarking, to say that I'm not familiar with Exeter marking after that period.

I've only owned one William Hope spoon. Excuse the poor photo, but I took it quite a while ago. It is from an 1827 teaspoon, and does have the city mark. However, I am not sure when Exeter first introduced this mark, so it could be between 1822 and 1827. Either way, the maker's mark is very similar.
I knew I would have to write a prequel to my Exeter article, but I didn't realise that a sequel would be necessary as well!

Miles

Image
.

AKL_ANN
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2008 6:13 am
Location: AKL

Postby AKL_ANN » Sun Jun 07, 2009 7:53 pm

This is really confused...
.

Granmaa
co-admin
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 9:32 am
Location: London
Contact:

Postby Granmaa » Sun Jun 07, 2009 9:08 pm

Certainly. Welcome to the world of British silver!

Miles
.

admin
Site Admin
Posts: 2526
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:52 pm

Postby admin » Mon Jun 08, 2009 3:40 pm

Hi,
Just received an email informing me that the same Lion & WH are illustrated on p.124 of McGrew's "Manufacturers' Marks on American Coin Silver" and attributed to William Hunter of Quebec.

Tom
.

Granmaa
co-admin
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 9:32 am
Location: London
Contact:

Postby Granmaa » Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:43 pm

Thanks Tom,

Do you have a picture of that mark?
The WH looks very similar to my William Hope mark, but I'm open to any disagreements.
I'm working on an Exeter 1810 onwards timeline, by the way.

Miles
.

admin
Site Admin
Posts: 2526
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:52 pm

Postby admin » Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:51 pm

Sorry Miles, I have a copy of the book, but it is out on loan.
.

robert12
contributor
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2009 1:41 pm

Re: Wang Hing Export?

Postby robert12 » Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:00 am

Hi Miles,

I know it is a while since you posted this topic but I have just got these tongs.
They are a typical pair from the Exeter area. A bit light on the weight at 34 gr.
Not particularly well made and seem almost pressed out of a sheet judging by the
rough unfinished edges on the inside. 14.5 cm long, monogram erased.
The marks are the same date as your spoon but more worn, also with no town mark.
These are your typical west country tongs so would tie in nicely with William Hope
https://db.tt/oN4Zqwhp
https://db.tt/vPtPUKju
https://db.tt/dJqfHySs

Bob

Granmaa
co-admin
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 9:32 am
Location: London
Contact:

Re: Wang Hing Export?

Postby Granmaa » Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:52 am

It's been a while since I've seen this topic.
Definitely William Hope, and although he did fake marks I think these are genuine.

Miles


Return to “Exeter Hallmarks”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest