Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

PHOTOS REQUIRED - marks + item
khan
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:37 pm

Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby khan » Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:52 am

Hi Guys,
Hamsa or Fatima Hand charm silver (Hand of Mary), please help me out (a) what does the arabic Script mean? (b) which mark is it ?
Thank you

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WarrenKundis
contributor
Posts: 609
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:20 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby WarrenKundis » Fri Dec 11, 2015 6:37 pm

Good Day Khan,

There are so many different aspects of what the Hamsa or hand of Fatima means I thought you might enjoy this link.

(admin edit - see Posting Requirements )

This appears to be the Arabic form although your images are rather fuzzy. Since this appears to be a pendant can you please reshoot the hand with the fingers facing down.

Now, made in the Middle East such as Morocco or Algeria? The make your showing appears to be a French makers mark in a logenze or diamond. Made by Muslim craftsmen under French supervision? Made in France then exported?

You may also find two other marks, one is also on the back and would be referred to as a bigorne. Please research the term here. The other is a French hallmark which would literally be on the opposite side from the bigorne.

I hope you don't find this too confusing. Have a few of these pieces myself, still trying to determine their history.

Warren

WarrenKundis
contributor
Posts: 609
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:20 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby WarrenKundis » Fri Dec 11, 2015 6:43 pm

Let's try this link again.

(admin edit - see Posting Requirements )

W

khan
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:37 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby khan » Mon Dec 14, 2015 11:10 am

Thanks Warren for sharing vauable knowledge. i will try to put some more photos of clear view, hopefully to get more informations. it is actually both Pendant and Brooch as well, has only one mark stamp.
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khan
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:37 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby khan » Mon Dec 14, 2015 11:46 am

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WarrenKundis
contributor
Posts: 609
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:20 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby WarrenKundis » Tue Dec 15, 2015 7:01 pm

Just to let you know that I can't view your new images on my laptop or old iPad.

W

khan
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:37 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby khan » Thu Dec 17, 2015 5:59 am

Hi Warren,
I hope evrything done good this time. Best regards

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WarrenKundis
contributor
Posts: 609
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:20 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby WarrenKundis » Thu Dec 17, 2015 3:07 pm

Thank you Khan for rotating the images.

The initials in the lozenge appear to be either H J or K J. Looking through the French makers marks on 925, was not able to identify the silversmith. Let's see if other members can assist you.

The last two image did not post but please do me one more favor. Try to give me a clear close up of the front and the back.

Have a great weekend.
Warren

khan
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:37 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby khan » Fri Dec 18, 2015 3:51 am

Good Morning Warren,
The last two scans were from Front and Back of the image but did not appear i think because of oversized. I try now file size to be reduced and same time images recognisable. Thank you once again for your all out effert and have a good day.

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dognose
Site Admin
Posts: 39274
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 12:53 pm
Location: England

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby dognose » Fri Dec 18, 2015 10:08 am


khan
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:37 pm

Re: Hamsa or Fatima (Hand of Mary) mark Indentification

Postby khan » Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:31 am

Thanks Trev.

Mystery still unsolved, quote a text from online article about Mark (ladder) hopefully this will give us a direction.

" It seems probable that the majority of French silver thimbles were made by the major houses and thimbles were marked with the house master’s mark. Sometimes other masters who either worked in the main house or in their own workshops ‘finished’ a thimble and then applied their mark. In this case, the thimble was made in the main house but may have been stamped with another master’s mark. Two such masters may have been from the Lévy family. Jacob and Jules Lévy of rue Pastourelle, Paris, registered their mark (a ladder) in 1884. Jacob then joined his son Jean in the rue Réaumur in 1888 and registered his mark ‘JL’ separated by a ladder. Jean seems to have adopted his father’s mark in 1908 but may have omitted the ‘JL’ according to the French Ministry of Culture site (6). It was cancelled in 1927. It would appear from the bill below, that Jean joined ‘ Le Dé à Coudre’ sometime before 1949 and before it was bought by Roger Lenain. As a result the Lévy dies became available for use by Roger Lenain also "


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